Am I the only one sick of it?

[rushtoexcellence]

[Originally posted by CP84:
If private schools had defined districts like public schools they would all be playing 8 man football or be in one room school houses. Someone made the argument earlier that West Branch has a district that has 120,000 residents.

That argument carries no weight because it's not an apples to apples comparison. Unless WB residents go to a private school they all go to WB school system. Regina is only pulling a small fraction of there surrounding community. If Regina had to have a similar district to WB they'd probably have 30 kids in the entire high school.

The only thing that matters at the end of the day is total enrollment. It doesn't make a difference how far the students had to drive.]



I am not sure anyone is saying they should have defined districts. It is just an advantage that private schools can use when sending busses to pick up kids in their younger years.

 

[CP84]

Originally posted by OtherWiseGinger:

Originally posted by CP84:

Originally posted by OtherWiseGinger:

Originally posted by Pinehawk:

Originally posted by pribs36:
Hopefully when the districts come out in a couple months all of this nonsense will be done and we can actually talk football like the good ole days..like when Solon and Harlan were winning 40+ games in a row

Exactly. I'll bet no one was complaining when Solon won 4 titles in a row and West Branch, Harlan, Emmetsburg, A-P, etc. were winning all the time.
Oh well, the record has been set. The Titles are in the books.

And, the rest of 1A can pray that Regina moves up and a worse team has a chance to win their class next year.

Solon's enrollment took care of the complaining by bumping them up a class or did you forget that part?

What's your point?

Pine is right. When public school have long runs of success nobody says anything. When private schools do, issues of recruiting and applied multipliers get brought up. The bottom line is there is no inherent advantage. All schools public and private are assigned to their class based on enrollement figures.

Did you fail to read my post - "THE COMPLAINING WAS TAKEN CARE OF BY ENROLLMENT BUMPING SOLON UP".
So people were complaining trust me!

The only advantage that I can see privates having is being selective - if litttle Johnny that is a thug and does not play sports and could care less about academics, is in trouble all the time applies to Private School A they have the ability to deny. If same kid moves into Public School B's district - they have no choice, they must accept them. When that happens at the rate of 10+ per class the enrollment goes up, etc.

The point is the complaints when public schools win pales compared to private schools. You don't see posts on every page ttitled "Am I the only one sick of it" inundated with 100 complaint responses. Recruitment and other presumed disadvantages are always brought up without clear evidence.

If we compare total high school enrollment #'s to junior/seniors participation in football it doesn't show any advantage in terms of participation rate as your second paragraph would assume.

South O'Brien 19.6%
E-Berg 19.3%
Regina 17.8%
Ogden 16.7%
West Branch 13.7%
North Fayette 13.0%
A-P 12.8%
Maquoketa Valley 12.7%
Dike 11.8%
Wilton 11.2%
Saint Edmond 10.6%
Ridgeview 9.9%
Clayton Ridge 8.4%

 

[cidhawkeye]

Originally posted by IAHSFBALL:
I think you need to re-read some of my previous posts, or at least read closer. I do not think our non public schools are recruiting. I think the advantages non public schools have go way deeper than that.I even hinted that I may be wrong and and the non public dominance is nothing more than a trend. Your obvious lack of knowledge of Iowa high schools makes me wonder why I respond to you. I have already stated that this problem goes beyond football. Western Christian is in NWIA, a stones throw from SD, NE, & MN. They have been a powerhouse volleyball and basketball school for as long as I can remember. Multiple titles. The homecoming article that was submitted to Bernie Saggau several years ago to try to convince him of the advantages of non publics in GBB and volleyball. The students discuss coming to WC in order to compete, it does not say what states they resided while school, just the states they came from in order to compete. Like I said before, if the majority of the country has decided that some sort of segregation our multiplier is viable, there must be something there.grow up young man, have a discussion like an adult. The smug internet tough guy thing isn't working for you.

This post was edited on 12/4 9:44 AM by IAHSFBALL

"Like I said before, if the majority of the country has decided that some sort of segregation our multiplier is viable, there must be something there.grow up young man, have a discussion like an adult. The smug internet tough guy thing isn't working for you."

Before you start casting stones perhaps you should re-read the articles that you linked. They referred to a state that had a multiplier and dropped it because nothing changed, a state that saw a 0.2% decline in championships won by private schools, nowhere in any of those articles did it indicate that a "majority" of the country has decided anything on this subject. In one of the outdated articles it indicated that 45 states have publics and privates competing together, that number has moved but the number is nowhere near a "majority". Perhaps before assailing a "smug internet tough guy" you should get your facts straight. What is worse not knowing anything about a school across the state or what a majority is?

 

[CP84]

Originally posted by GoEagles23:

Originally posted by CP84:

If private schools had defined districts like public schools they would all be playing 8 man football or be in one room school houses. Someone made the argument earlier that West Branch has a district that has




Thanks for helping the public school cause, broski.

You don't seem to grasp the point. Private schools aren't in defined districts because rather than taking nearly all the population in the district they only take a fraction. For example if you said Cedar Rapids Xavier could only take students from Northwest Cedar Rapids the school would be tiny. They have to pull from a larger geographic area because a smaller percent of kids in the area attend private schools than public schools. This doesn't mean they have an advantage over public schools with similar enrollment numbers when it comes to sports.

 

[Iron Doc]

Is it to safe to assume that my proposed 3rd option, the Iron Doc Memorial Sports HS, won't be happening any time soon? I don't sense on here that it is considered a viable option. That is unfortunate as it could go a long way towards defusing State School vs. Church School tensions.

 

[pribs36]

All the reasons or better known as "excuses" being made are completely useless in the argument, no one still will answer why Regina never qualified for the football playoffs for 32 years (1972-2004) and still had every single one of these advantages people are listing off, or why these "advantages" aren't helping the basketball program and other average sports programs at the school. Like people have stated a million times if you want a multiplier because some private schools (like many other public schools) have great coaching staffs and strength and conditioning programs than so be it. But don't come on here making up a bunch of BS excuses to why SOME private school football programs are thriving. Also prepare next year for every class that has two public schools in the finals to have ZERO threads about private schools on this site, it happens every year. So hopefully you continue to enjoy making excuses on a message board but I hate to break your hearts..nothing is going to happen.

 

[SASF]

+1

 

[OtherWiseGinger]

Originally posted by CP84:

Originally posted by OtherWiseGinger:

Originally posted by CP84:

Originally posted by OtherWiseGinger:

Originally posted by Pinehawk:

Originally posted by pribs36:
Hopefully when the districts come out in a couple months all of this nonsense will be done and we can actually talk football like the good ole days..like when Solon and Harlan were winning 40+ games in a row

Exactly. I'll bet no one was complaining when Solon won 4 titles in a row and West Branch, Harlan, Emmetsburg, A-P, etc. were winning all the time.
Oh well, the record has been set. The Titles are in the books.

And, the rest of 1A can pray that Regina moves up and a worse team has a chance to win their class next year.

Solon's enrollment took care of the complaining by bumping them up a class or did you forget that part?

What's your point?

Pine is right. When public school have long runs of success nobody says anything. When private schools do, issues of recruiting and applied multipliers get brought up. The bottom line is there is no inherent advantage. All schools public and private are assigned to their class based on enrollement figures.

Did you fail to read my post - "THE COMPLAINING WAS TAKEN CARE OF BY ENROLLMENT BUMPING SOLON UP".
So people were complaining trust me!

The only advantage that I can see privates having is being selective - if litttle Johnny that is a thug and does not play sports and could care less about academics, is in trouble all the time applies to Private School A they have the ability to deny. If same kid moves into Public School B's district - they have no choice, they must accept them. When that happens at the rate of 10+ per class the enrollment goes up, etc.

The point is the complaints when public schools win pales compared to private schools. You don't see posts on every page ttitled "Am I the only one sick of it" inundated with 100 complaint responses. Recruitment and other presumed disadvantages are always brought up without clear evidence.

If we compare total high school enrollment #'s to junior/seniors participation in football it doesn't show any advantage in terms of participation rate as your second paragraph would assume.

South O'Brien 19.6%
E-Berg 19.3%
Regina 17.8%
Ogden 16.7%
West Branch 13.7%
North Fayette 13.0%
A-P 12.8%
Maquoketa Valley 12.7%
Dike 11.8%
Wilton 11.2%
Saint Edmond 10.6%
Ridgeview 9.9%
Clayton Ridge 8.4%

Really? Take Xavier - Enrollment 550, Varsity roster 86 vs WDV - largest school in the state with 2100+ kids, varsity roster 74... See any difference there CP?

I could go on with more but I posted about the enrollments vs roster size in another thread.

 

[pribs36]

Roster sizes for schools is an irrelevant argument, when rosters are in 70's and 80's well over 60% of the players aren't even touching the field so its just a matter of how many kids are willing to be on the team to stand on the sideline, also WDM could easily dress more then 74, my Xavier sources tell me that the coach lets the sophs on the roster for playoffs if they chose to join the ride so that makes the roster higher as well, even if that isn't true the argument still isn't relevant among 4A schools. Also I am sure people could come up with a ton of schools with large rosters that don't have much success and schools with very small rosters that do have big success --> (St. Edmond) so it really isn't a good argument.

 

[GoEagles23]

somebody just posted "give me an reason to why Regina didn't make playoffs for 32 years with same advantages and now is making it every year"

perhaps you should tell me why all of the sudden the bloom is on the rose there.

Pribs you have an excuse or answer for everything. You must vote Democrat.

 

[cidhawkeye]

Now it's political? He asked a question, and your answer is "democrat" . I would like to know the answer.

 

[pribs36]

Eagles I am conservative as hell! haha and did you read my post? I said if coaching staff is an advantage then put in the multiplier..that is the answer to your question, coaching staff!!

 

[Pinehawk]

Yep, coaching staff and success breeds more success.
The kids want to continue the tradition and winning streak.

 

[GoEagles23]

You guys tell me how the "Auburn Syndrome" got into the Regina HS FB program?

Auburn in 2008 was 5-7
Auburn in 2010 won a national title.
How do you go from not even being in a bowl to winning a title 2 years later?
It doesn't happen that quickly. Ever.

Regina goes from an also ran to the most vaunted program in the state of Iowa? Make sense to me.

 

[cidhawkeye]

2004 Qualify for playoffs
2005 1st
2006 Qualify for playoffs
2007 2nd
2008 Qualify for playoffs
2009 Qualify for playoffs
2010 1st
2011 1st
2012 1st
2013 1st

So it looks like a building process, you can thank Solon and West Branch for setting the bar high for Regina to shoot for.

 

[pribs36]

2004 was semi finalist as well. Many people to thank way beyond the coaching staff today. You really gotta give credit to former coaches Matt Mitchell who I believe coaches in college now and Kevin Miller (solon) for emphasizing weight training at a struggling program. Then you got Chuck Evans who had a couple tough years but kept the excitement in the program alive and it payed off with a state title, after the title was won football became the most popular sport at the school. The current coaches didn't start from the bottom, they just took a program that was thriving to a whole new level. Many people credit the 1999 team that was coached by Mitchell that truly turned the program around. The program had suffered I think 10 losing seasons in a row and he came in and made big changes eventually leading to a tie for a district championship that season unfortunately with the old playoff format they were left out, but after that people were excited about the program again which led to more participation and excitement. There was a great article in the CR gazette last year about the history of the Regina football program that talks about this in more detail I can bring up the link for you if you want, its actually a great story.

 

[GoEagles23]

no thanks on seeing a link of Regina's football history. i would rather poke my eye out than to have watch that.

 

[ljb33]

Originally posted by GoEagles23:
no thanks on seeing a link of Regina's football history. i would rather poke my eye out than to have watch that.

translation: "thanks for proving me wrong, but I still will not admit it"

 

[Rembrandt52328]

I know this issue will never go away, however there are a lot of people out there who are making comments that they are “sick” of the so called Cahtolic School Dominance in Football as they see it.

Here are some numbers from the IHSAA:

1. In the last 41 years (prior to this year and since playoffs were initiated), non-public schools have made up 8% of the football playoff qualifiers. Public schools make up the other 92%. Coincidentally, 8.2% of the football playing high schools in Iowa are non-public. The other 91.8% are public.

2. Other than 2013, 12% of the state champions since the playoff system began have been non-public schools. The other 88% have been public schools.

3. In 20 of the 42 years of football playoffs, no Catholic school has won a championship in any class. In 4 of the 42 years of football playoffs, Catholic schools have won the state championship in more than one class.

4. The record for championships in every class is held by a public school (shared in class 2A with 3 public schools and one non-public). Iowa City Regina won four state titles combined in two different classes.

5. It’s clear that there is no historical imbalance of Catholic schools qualifying for playoffs or winning state football championships. The past two years, and this year in particular, have seen exceptional success for Catholic schools but that has been the exception rather than the rule.

6. In the past five years, not one recruiting complaint against any Catholic or public school has been filed. If recruiting were as rampant as some claim, why is no one reporting it?

So “If Catholic Schools recruit athletes, why are we not consistently winning state championships in all sports?”

Insinuations are easy to make. But if you think there is a problem then call the IHSAA and give them some facts and examples. That’s what they are there for. If you’re just mad because your Kid’s team got beat by a Catholic School in the State Semis or Finals. Then take a good look at those programs and try to immulate them and their success....Get Better!

This post was edited on 12/6 3:38 PM by Rembrandt52328

 

[OtherWiseGinger]

Originally posted by pribs36:
Roster sizes for schools is an irrelevant argument, when rosters are in 70's and 80's well over 60% of the players aren't even touching the field so its just a matter of how many kids are willing to be on the team to stand on the sideline, also WDM could easily dress more then 74, my Xavier sources tell me that the coach lets the sophs on the roster for playoffs if they chose to join the ride so that makes the roster higher as well, even if that isn't true the argument still isn't relevant among 4A schools. Also I am sure people could come up with a ton of schools with large rosters that don't have much success and schools with very small rosters that do have big success --> (St. Edmond) so it really isn't a good argument.

I disagree - roster size does play. If you don't have to play bothways, huge advantage. If you don' t to have your starters going against each other in practice when scrimmaging, huge advantage. Yes there are programs that have high participation and low results. My post was regarding a school with enrollment of a 3A school has more Jr\Sr out for football than the largest school in the state.

Solon had 36 on their varsity roster when compared to an enrollment of 350s so something like 10% participation rate.

 

[GoEagles23]

Originally posted by ljb33:

Originally posted by GoEagles23:
no thanks on seeing a link of Regina's football history. i would rather poke my eye out than to have watch that.

translation: "thanks for proving me wrong, but I still will not admit it"

um, I am a new dog in the fight here but I am sure if you go back to the early 00's and all of the 90s you will see playoffs were not exactly Regina's norm.

Some of YOU guys are the ones saying that ICR was not a good team for 30+ years and now they are good so why are people making a fuss about it?

Schools like Solon and WB have been doing it for a long time.
WB was 6-4 this year and that seems like a bad year for them.

 

[cidhawkeye]

I missed your question earlier, Auburn recruited a QB named Newton and if something has already happened (Auburn) then saying that things don't happen like that "ever" doesn't look real bright. Regina building for 10 years doesn't seem to be an overnight thing.

 

[cloudwatcher]

Blame,

Been awhile..welcome back..however brief. thanks for the post. It's nice to see a WB guy give Regina some props.

I know you will never be convinced that there is no private school advantage. That's ok..we can agree to disagree right? So I do want to ask you one question...I understand if you don't reply as you have retired from this online banter.

If Regina has such and advantage over public schools like West Branch

WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME REGINA BEAT WEST BRANCH IN BASKETBALL?

AAAAAHHHHHH Same kids, same "Advantages" But it's been 3-4 years!!

See, I agree with some previous posters. If this is such and advantage why does it only seem to be in Football? ( I will leave the Regina soccer kids out of it since most smaller public schools don't have a soccer program.) My guess is, as I have not researched this, is that this is not uncommon. When was the last time Dowling, Heelan, Keumeper, Regina, Xavier won a boys state basketball championship or even got there? (i'm sure somebody is looking it up right now) I remember a few years ago Solon won 4 football and a couple basketball..and a few track..all within 4 years. OH and a couple Baseball!!

If Private schools have all of these advantages why aren't they dominating every single sport, not just football. Also, let's keep this all in perspective folks. The worm will turn..it always does. There will be a year, sooner than later, when the majority of schools in the final 4 of each class will be public. I think the biggest difference right now is that the kids and the staff at Regina have brought a different brand of football to the 1A/2A level. Teams will catch up eventually..they will have to.

One thing I think we can all agree on in this thread. The best 1A football in the state was played on the Eastside. Hands Down. The Ridge and MValley gave Regina all they wanted and Regina's district was tough as hell. IMO 1A football on the eastside is better than 2A..at least right now. There are some good 2A teams but from top to bottom 1A is better. Take the top 5-6 1A teams from D5 and D6 and most 2A teams in this area would have a rough time. The Ridge and MValley would have sailed through the west side and were probably the next best teams next to Regina. Regals were just above them all this year. Credit to all the coaches and kids from all those schools.

I am out. Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays to all. Even Eagle and Pig.

Actually after reading this I am going to edit one thing. I take back my Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to Pig. He called Regina's MLB and elf on another thread...not cool. You get coal in your stocking this year.
This post was edited on 12/6 11:04 PM by cloudwatcher

 

[pribs36]

I am going to bet that Blame waits until this years Regina WB bball game to respond because Regina is probably going to win so there will probably be some new advantage to the bball program that just started this year, but I am with Cloud here, I am done with the message boards for the time being. Merry Xmas to all and i'm sure i'll be back around redistricting time!

 

[GoEagles23]

i can look at the box scores so far and tell you WB will get drive-by shot destroyed by the Regals this year. doesn't take BlameIt to tell you that.

 

[tm3308]

Really? Take Xavier - Enrollment 550, Varsity roster 86 vs WDV - largest school in the state with 2100+ kids, varsity roster 74... See any difference there CP?

I could go on with more but I posted about the enrollments vs roster size in another thread.

You realize that Xavier, according to those numbers, gets roughly 15% of their enrollment (and if your enrollment number is just BEDS, then that doesn't even take the senior class into account). For Valley to get 15% of their enrollment out for football, they'd need to have over 300 kids on the team. Conversely, if Xavier were to only field a roster that represents (roughly) four percent of their total enrollment (like Valley does), they would have 22 kids out for football.

4A varsity rosters are typically anywhere from 70-90 kids. Xavier might have more kids on their roster this year, but Valley also has a VERY deep pool to pick from and can cut the rest in tryouts.

 

[OtherWiseGinger]

Originally posted by tm3308:

Really? Take Xavier - Enrollment 550, Varsity roster 86 vs WDV - largest school in the state with 2100+ kids, varsity roster 74... See any difference there CP?

I could go on with more but I posted about the enrollments vs roster size in another thread.

You realize that Xavier, according to those numbers, gets roughly 15% of their enrollment (and if your enrollment number is just BEDS, then that doesn't even take the senior class into account). For Valley to get 15% of their enrollment out for football, they'd need to have over 300 kids on the team. Conversely, if Xavier were to only field a roster that represents (roughly) four percent of their total enrollment (like Valley does), they would have 22 kids out for football.

4A varsity rosters are typically anywhere from 70-90 kids. Xavier might have more kids on their roster this year, but Valley also has a VERY deep pool to pick from and can cut the rest in tryouts.

take out the Freshman class and replace with Senior class - they are near identical in size

 

[tm3308]

Originally posted by OtherWiseGinger:

Originally posted by tm3308:

Really? Take Xavier - Enrollment 550, Varsity roster 86 vs WDV - largest school in the state with 2100+ kids, varsity roster 74... See any difference there CP?

I could go on with more but I posted about the enrollments vs roster size in another thread.

You realize that Xavier, according to those numbers, gets roughly 15% of their enrollment (and if your enrollment number is just BEDS, then that doesn't even take the senior class into account). For Valley to get 15% of their enrollment out for football, they'd need to have over 300 kids on the team. Conversely, if Xavier were to only field a roster that represents (roughly) four percent of their total enrollment (like Valley does), they would have 22 kids out for football.

4A varsity rosters are typically anywhere from 70-90 kids. Xavier might have more kids on their roster this year, but Valley also has a VERY deep pool to pick from and can cut the rest in tryouts.

take out the Freshman class and replace with Senior class - they are near identical in size

Regardless, that's still 15% of their BEDS out for football. Which is roughly what they need to field a competitive roster in 4A, since they're a 3A-sized school playing up a class (which is EXACTLY what most of the people whining want Regina, St. Albert, Heelan, etc. to do).

You can't make private schools play up a class and then whine about how they have too many kids out for a school with their enrollment, simply because bigger schools have rosters of similar size. Because wasn't that the general idea in the first place, to make private schools play with bigger schools to level the playing field?

 

[Rembrandt52328]

So Greasedpig75 started this and I have a question? What school is your school. All of this started after Regina beat NFV in the Semifinals. If you are a NFV fan ( good for you because I have family there and they have a great football tradition ) how can you complain?

So you slap a multiplier on Regina and they move up to 2A! Isn't NFV going to 2A next year? The NFV coach said it best when he said they needed to get better and do new things to compete. If they had a decent passing game the outcome might have been different in that semi final.

 

[GreasedPig75]

Not a NFV fan. I posted this because Regina had just captured their 4th straight title or 3rd or however many. Can't even keep track anymore. If the state would do a little research into the place there wouldn't be a need for multiplier. Bet you Regina is lying about their enrollment.

 

[cidhawkeye]

I think so as well, I think they are building a building over on first avenue where just enough non participants will go to school, the number fluctuates depending on what they need to do to keep their BEDS number down. It is really a shady deal, I think greased should be the lead investigator, he seems like the sharp kind of guy that can get to the bottom of this mess.

 

[GreasedPig75]

Cid your kids are in the system. You know whats behind the curtains. And Regina is smart enough to cover their butts on all of it. Nothing will change. This was a terrible thread to start. It's like walking right into a wall. Same excuses, oh Regina this, oh Regina that. Lets just let it go on. I think I might have my son play water polo. Does Regina have a team he could join?

 

[cidhawkeye]

My kids are in the system. I am not in admissions and I am pretty certain I don't "know what is behind the curtain" What I do know is that most of the people that complain about how Regina operates are pretty much clueless to the realities of how they do things. They hear "true stories" about the recruiting, coaches getting huge salaries, cheating on BEDS and all kinds of shenanigans. How do they know they are "true stories", well my cousin Bob's friend who went to school with a guy who was a cousin to a person who knew somebody who had kids at Regina 10 years ago said that it really happened. People present opinion as fact because they can't figure out how that program can achieve like it has. The reality is a perfect storm has occurred, hard working, talented kids, with great coaching and parent support entered that school 15 years ago. They do things to build the program, they have played City High, Bettendorf and Solon at the freshman level to set the benchmark of where they need to be, they have a weight training program where kids enjoy getting better everyday. Yet people look at them and say "they cheat". I guess I do know "what is behind the curtain" and I am happy to say my kids are part of it. My oldest son is playing college.football, chooses to lift in the summer at Regina, the first.question from every.coach" how is school, how are your grades?" Its about the people at that school. So you can toss allegations all you want, be disrespectful without knowing what is going on all you want or maybe work for a.change, make your program better, send your kids there so you count the kids who go to school there, get behind the curtain. Just be intellectually honest and factual when you take shots at them. Don't let bias and a lack of understanding discredit what that program has achieved or the people in it.

 

[GoEagles23]

hey CIDHawkeye, how is McBeth doing?
He moved into the district from Pekin.

 

[regaldad]

Memo to pig and eagle,Regina is going for 5 straight titles and 70 wins.Lets just enjoy the ride together.Peace my brothers.

 

[tm3308]

Originally posted by GreasedPig75:
Not a NFV fan. I posted this because Regina had just captured their 4th straight title or 3rd or however many. Can't even keep track anymore. If the state would do a little research into the place there wouldn't be a need for multiplier. Bet you Regina is lying about their enrollment.

Yeah, because THAT'S not a baseless accusation.

Seriously, that's just downright pathetic. I should know, since I made the same argument 6 years ago when I was an idiotic high school student.

 

[GoEagles23]

Originally posted by regaldad:
Memo to pig and eagle,Regina is going for 5 straight titles and 70 wins.Lets just enjoy the ride together.Peace my brothers.

so the idea of McBeth living with a coach doesn't bother you?

 

[printit]

What Coach? I'm sure your close source provided the name of who he lives with. So what coach does he live with?

 

[cidhawkeye]

McBeth is doing well. Think he even started some games this year. Not sure which coach he lives with, I am sure you will share that information.

 

[OtherWiseGinger]

Originally posted by cidhawkeye:
McBeth is doing well. Think he even started some games this year. Not sure which coach he lives with, I am sure you will share that information.

Cid- since you are "behind the curtain" can you lay truth to this Mcbeth from Pekin to Regina? Is he living with a coach? You should be able to answer yes or no without dropping names.