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1A District 7

DarkThunder#61

All State
Sep 28, 2005
10,606
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Scores from Week 1:

Manson-Northwest Webster 54, Southeast Valley 26
Ogden 23, Panorama 13
South Hamilton 24, Roland-Story 10
St. Edmond 14, Bishop Garrigan 7
Madrid 28, Van Meter 13
South Central Calhoun 12, Greene County 6

Earlham 28, Woodward Academy 23

Not a bad start for D7. 6-1 after the first week. Wins over rivals, including a couple of ranked opponents, and a few wins against teams from bigger classes as well. We'll see what progress each team makes going into week 2.

This post was edited on 8/31 2:50 AM by DarkThunder#61
 
Should be a great district. Some "big boy" football gonna be played in this district. Some traditionally physical teams.
 
New rankings were released on Tuesday. 6 D7 teams received votes in the AP poll and 3 were ranked in the top 10.
 
District 4 was also 6-1.

the "District of Death"

They have a much deeper district than D7, IMHO
 
I might be biased, but that's pretty tough to say that district 4 is deeper than D7. The top 3 teams are very good teams, S. Winn, Clayton Ridge, & DNH will be tough opponents for any team in 1A. The probable 4 seed being Sumner-Fredericksburg is another team that makes D4 "deep". Beyond those 4 teams though, you are stretching it a little bit to say they are 'deep'. Hudson is an average team at best, and no one on these boards will argue that Jesup or MFL are even that.

D7 on the other hand has the 2013 runner up in St Edmonds, albeit, they are probably down a bit this year from last. MNW lost 2 of their 3 games to St Eds, and arguably should have beat them the 2nd time around. They return quite a bit and could well be the team to beat down the road. SCC is coming down from a playoff qualifying year in 2A, and Ogden, South Ham, & Madrid are all teams that qualified for playoffs last year and will not go down easily this year. Ogden lost a very good QB, but returns some excellent athletes that are dangerous in space. Madrid will be better than last year as they return almost the entire starting lineup on both sides of the ball. Then you have Woodward Academy who would not be a viewed as a major threat.

The top teams aren't too far off, although I might give top strength to D4 as of right now, and one of them might win it all, but after the top teams, D7 has more teams who will competing for playoffs and beyond than D4 does. In my definition, that is what defines a district as being 'deep'.
This post was edited on 9/4 1:10 PM by Bringin the Heat
 
Should be some good games coming from this district. SE, MNW, Ogden are my favorites to win the district. But Madrid could surprise. And a nice win by South Hamilton over Roland Story. SE sure does need to do more offensively than 14pts. Bad weather I am sure had some affect. Still, they only threw the ball a few times. It is early though. MNW obviously played well. But not sure how good SEV is? Ogden beating a good Panorama team has to give them some confidence.
This post was edited on 9/5 10:38 AM by L N D
 
Its Southeast valley not SWV! Anyway my prediction on the 2A board for SEV is 6-3 and I still stand by that. MNW will be a big threat to win district because of their o-line and RB,QB. Not a manson fan but was at fri. game and their line dominated the game.
 
Originally posted by BlameIt:
District 4 was also 6-1.

the "District of Death"

They have a much deeper district than D7, IMHO
Well if we're going back to that, as I recall, my argument wasn't that D7 was one of the best. Just that you undervalued them in your rankings........just sayin.
smokin.r191677.gif
 
Scores from Week 2:

Manson-Northwest Webster 35, Panorama 2
Ogden 49, Des Moines Christian 21
St. Edmond 75, Mason City Newman 0
South Hamilton 40, West Marshall 0
Madrid 52, Woodward-Granger 16
Woodward Academy 28, Southeast Warren 14
East Sac County 14, South Central Calhoun 12


Another 6-1 performance from D7. Woodward Academy gets on the board, and the Titans with the lone defeat in a close one to a conference rival. Some very good offenses in this district.

And in case you're wondering about the St. Edmond score, most of the starters were pretty much out by half way through the 2nd qtr. It was 48-0 at half time and the Gaels returned the opening kickoff for a touchdown to start the 2nd half. Kids from all 4 classes scored a touchdown in this game. There were kids on the field that weren't even listed in the program. SE never faced a 4th down and many of their drives didn't even last 5 plays.
 
can you explain to me 2 starters teaming up for a 2 point conversion while leading 73-0. I wasn't at the game but did listen to parts on the radio. I understand when a team is outmanned, I have seen continuous clock games before. But, that was their first 2 point conversion try on the night....and to attempt it while leading 73-0 ?
 
Originally posted by spook78:
can you explain to me 2 starters teaming up for a 2 point conversion while leading 73-0. I wasn't at the game but did listen to parts on the radio. I understand when a team is outmanned, I have seen continuous clock games before. But, that was their first 2 point conversion try on the night....and to attempt it while leading 73-0 ?
Hmm, I was going to have some fun and simply indulge your imagination, but I think first thing's first (had a post typed up and everything but then deleted it for this), so I will allow you the benefit of the doubt, instead, and we'll just see how you intend to play this out.........

Did you listen to that play on the radio or just read about it in the Messenger? (And spare me any dramatics beyond that. Just answer that question. Yes, I felt like I had to qualify that for you.)
 
Originally posted by Bringin the Heat:
Why doesn't St. Edmonds list all their athletes on their programs and on quikstats?
I'm assuming that at the start of the year, the kids they listed were the only ones they initially felt would contribute at the varsity level, but obviously that changes as the season progresses and already a few weeks worth of practices into the season, they must have decided to move a few younger kids up to dress on the sidelines. The last TD scored was by a freshman. In fact, I'm curious now to find out the last time a freshman scored a TD in a varsity game for the Gaels before yesterday.

There's a certain time table to update Quikstats each week as well, so they'll probably update it again by next week.
 
Originally posted by spook78:

I'd like to hear your explanation of the play, that way I would have 2.
That's not gonna happen until you answer the question.

If you want to draw this out, you'd be answering another question I have regarding your motive. Just with this reply, you are removing that benefit of the doubt I'm trying to extend to you.

Then I'll indulge your imagination.
 
Motive? I'm just waiting to hear any explanation you have as to why a team would attempt and complete a 2 pt conversion with a 73-0 lead.
This post was edited on 9/6 10:31 AM by spook78
 
In my opinion, going for 2 up that many pts no matter who is playing is classless! But ST. Eds is usually that way so I guess I should have known better. Some day the roles may be reversed and they might not like it.
 
O.K. Let's get some facts here. First, for all of you are putting St. Ed's down, where any of you at the game last night? or did any of you listen to it on the radio?

The two point conversion that has a lot of you fired up came on a fire play. In other words, the holder had problems handling the ball and you yell a word like 'fire' and everyone knows the snap was bad so you try to score two points. I don't recall you caught the ball, but the holder was a starter on defense but is the backup quarterback for the Gaels. He is also the backup holder as well. He is a junior. I don't know if they actually have a third string quarterback.

Two, St. Ed's has small numbers out for football. In the program, which did not have all the players listed on it, there are only eleven players who are not seniors. That does not include some freshman who saw some action last night. Last year St. Ed's had only three freshman go out. This year it is up to nine. Not real big numbers in the lower classes as you can see.
I think they may have 13 seniors on their rooster.

Thirdly, as the game went on, I could sense the St. Ed's coaches where uncomfortable with the score. I know because I was there and saw their facial expressions. Personally, I felt sorry for the Knights. I thought it might be a closer game given what the Gaels did against Algona Garrigan (Not sure if I spelled that one correctly) last week. The score was 14-0 at half and the Gaels had to hold on for a 14-7 win. The game was still in doubt with less than two minutes to go in the game with the Bears driving for at least a tie. The quarterback fumble the ball and the defense recovered it. End of game. The Gaels did not look good in week 1.

For what it is worth, after the game, it really felt like a defeat to many of the fans, even though the Gaels won. I don't think anyone likes to see a score like that.

I am not sure what you do in an instance like this. Do you tell your kids to fumble the ball, I know coaches who have done this, or to fall down on purpose? I think part of the reason the score was so high was because the Gaels don't have a large number of underclassmen. When they put backups in, the tend to be seniors who play a lot or junior who don't see a lot of action. I have got to believe the Gaels play at least 8 players both ways like many smaller schools do.

I would like to hear from others who might have a suggestion as to how not to run up the score on schools who are less competitive. This happens a lot.

In the end, it is easy to form opinions that are not totally based on facts. If you had the facts on this game, some of you might not be hating so much on the Gaels.
 
What a big baby warriors dad. Nice ad hominem attack against an entire school, and the same school that has won the sportsmanship award countless times.
 
i was waiting to hear "botched play". It is still a 2 pt attempt and 2 pt completion with a 73 point lead.. A suggestion would have been to run the ball instead of pass when the score is that much of a spread. If st eds was truly using subs half way thru the 2nd quarter plus during the 2nd half the PLAYERS knew the game was in control and that the coaches were trying to cruise.. hence even in a botched play situation they scored because they wanted to score.
some advice,as Ive heard many times on these boards "act like you've been there before"
 
CP3O-I live in FT. Dodge and most not all fans are very snobby and when I spoke to a friend of mine that was at the game he wishes ST eds should have started kneeling it down and let the clock wind. Baby, I think not. Like I said before what comes around eventually turns around. Enjoy your victory.
 
Spook,

Where you at the game? If you was, you would know that many of the St. Ed's TD's came on long runs where the KNights missed tackles. One came on a pass interception and another came on the opening kick off in the second half that was run back for a TD. Passing, the Gaels were 2-2, both second quarter. There were TD runs of 44 and 50. Another long run came from O'Tool's first carry from scrimmage that went 77 yards. O'Tool had 151 yards on just 7 carries. Overall, the Gaels ran a total of 34 plays from scrimmage. in contrast, Newman ran 53 plays. Most of the Gaels plays were the same ones the run every game. It is not hard to figure out what plays Coach Tithe is going to run from scrimmage every week.

All I want to know is two things:

1) how do you tell your second stringers not to try very hard.
2) how would you, as a coach, stop from running up the score?

Suggestions are welcome.
 
Name the snob fans you are referring to then rather than cowardly anonymous attacks against an entire fanbase. No team in their right mind is just going to kneel out the entire 4th quarter. If anything that is more disrespectful to your opponents than putting in the second string and running the ball. It's also an opportunity to let players who rarely get in the game a chance to play. Sounds like you are just suffering from some sour grapes.
This post was edited on 9/6 2:03 PM by CP84
 
I will just say that in all the years we've played st. Edmond...they are some of the classiest coaches you will find. Really good people. Given it was a botched snap it is understandable that instinct took over and they ran "fire". Too bad that score got out of hand...but it's not like they were onside kicking to get the ball back.
 
Originally posted by Greenvapor:

O.K. Let's get some facts here. First, for all of you are putting St. Ed's down, where any of you at the game last night? or did any of you listen to it on the radio?

The two point conversion that has a lot of you fired up came on a fire play. In other words, the holder had problems handling the ball and you yell a word like 'fire' and everyone knows the snap was bad so you try to score two points. I don't recall you caught the ball, but the holder was a starter on defense but is the backup quarterback for the Gaels. He is also the backup holder as well. He is a junior. I don't know if they actually have a third string quarterback.

Two, St. Ed's has small numbers out for football. In the program, which did not have all the players listed on it, there are only eleven players who are not seniors. That does not include some freshman who saw some action last night. Last year St. Ed's had only three freshman go out. This year it is up to nine. Not real big numbers in the lower classes as you can see.
I think they may have 13 seniors on their rooster.

Thirdly, as the game went on, I could sense the St. Ed's coaches where uncomfortable with the score. I know because I was there and saw their facial expressions. Personally, I felt sorry for the Knights. I thought it might be a closer game given what the Gaels did against Algona Garrigan (Not sure if I spelled that one correctly) last week. The score was 14-0 at half and the Gaels had to hold on for a 14-7 win. The game was still in doubt with less than two minutes to go in the game with the Bears driving for at least a tie. The quarterback fumble the ball and the defense recovered it. End of game. The Gaels did not look good in week 1.

For what it is worth, after the game, it really felt like a defeat to many of the fans, even though the Gaels won. I don't think anyone likes to see a score like that.

I am not sure what you do in an instance like this. Do you tell your kids to fumble the ball, I know coaches who have done this, or to fall down on purpose? I think part of the reason the score was so high was because the Gaels don't have a large number of underclassmen. When they put backups in, the tend to be seniors who play a lot or junior who don't see a lot of action. I have got to believe the Gaels play at least 8 players both ways like many smaller schools do.

I would like to hear from others who might have a suggestion as to how not to run up the score on schools who are less competitive. This happens a lot.

In the end, it is easy to form opinions that are not totally based on facts. If you had the facts on this game, some of you might not be hating so much on the Gaels.
Eh fine. I wasn't sure how long the suspense would last before someone tried to explain what happened.

You see the thing is though they have their subjective and pre-conceived opinions and basically nothing we say is going to dissuade them of their opinion (or they will only further question things just to make something out of nothing, which is what spook initially did. I just didn't want to call him on it yet.)

I would've been content just letting them think what they want and never knowing what actually happened, because it's their fault for jumping to conclusions. But this works too I guess.
 
Originally posted by warriors dad:
In my opinion, going for 2 up that many pts no matter who is playing is classless! But ST. Eds is usually that way so I guess I should have known better. Some day the roles may be reversed and they might not like it.
Holy pent up animosity Mr. Proud Parent.........

Let me guess...you're hoping one of those days of role-reversal will be against Southeast Valley in about a month or so, yes?
tongue.r191677.gif


Btw, you know where SE football was just over a decade ago, so the roles WERE reversed before. Heck the current coaching staff has seen plenty of those instances themselves. I still remember them well.
flush.r191677.gif
 
Originally posted by spook78:
i was waiting to hear "botched play". It is still a 2 pt attempt and 2 pt completion with a 73 point lead.. A suggestion would have been to run the ball instead of pass when the score is that much of a spread. If st eds was truly using subs half way thru the 2nd quarter plus during the 2nd half the PLAYERS knew the game was in control and that the coaches were trying to cruise.. hence even in a botched play situation they scored because they wanted to score.
some advice,as Ive heard many times on these boards "act like you've been there before"
The JV kids aren't gonna run dive left and dive right especially when Newman had their starters in until late in the 4th. They gain nothing by doing that. Then again the Gaels' run plays aren't particularly exotic to begin with.

And like I told Greenvapor, I was content with letting your imagination run wild as to what actually happened, since you couldn't just say how you found out about it, and rather tried to make something out of nothing, which is a specialty of yours (there I said it).

It was a botched play, and the kids simply executed what they were coached to do in that situation. The previous PAT had been blocked and on this one the snap was fumbled and could have been blocked again, so they broke it off. They weren't trying to show off. They weren't deliberately trying to score 2 pts from the start. As Greenvapor said, they just went through their 'fire' play. The only exception the Newman coaches (who would actually care) took to it was that it worked, not that they ran it.

Deal with it.
 
Originally posted by warriors dad:

I spoke to a friend of mine that was at the game he wishes ST eds would have started kneeling it down and let the clock wind.
When?...
 
11. Thou Shalt Not Run Up the Score Against One of MY Schools.



SE better be careful they don't piss off the boss.
 
Warrior Dad,

So in other words you were not at the game and got second information. I did no see any snobbish behavior at the game.. Let's hear it, who, when and where did the SE fans come across as snobbish. It is easy to say that. Now back it up.. I can tell you for a fact that SE school officials were very aware of cheers coming from the stands that would come across as taunting as they are at every game. I stood around the consesion area for a lot of the game. I was there, fact. You were not,fact. Your information is all second and colored by the eyes who told you that. I have a dog in the fight.. I am a huge supporter of Gael athletics. It does not take a rocket scientist to figure that out. So yea, me eyes are colored green. Now, if you was there we could have adult conversation about the game.

You still have not answered my question.
What did you want SE to do when the lead was so big? Or any other school for that matter. Like I said in a previous post I know coaches who have told their players to fumble the ball on purpose. I was on the sideline of one particular game and I questioned the coach afterwards. Coach felt after he told his qb to do it and said he would never go it again. And lik another poster said, SE has been on the other side of the stick and will be again some day. By, chance did you see the Harlan, Carroll score? Harlan lost at Harlan 42-0 last night. They may lucky to win half their games this year. What goes around comes around.

I just want to know who the snobs are and what do you want teams to do, notice I did not say SE, because scores like this happen very year to do when the are up big?
 
Originally posted by ghost80:

11. Thou Shalt Not Run Up the Score Against One of MY Schools.



SE better be careful they don't piss off the boss.
NICE!
 
12. thou shall not attempt and complete a 2 pt conversion with a 73 point lead.
explain it anyway you want to guys to make yourselves feel ok that it happened, but its pretty poor when all you had to do was fall on the muffed snap. With as much wisdom and knowledge as your coach has I'm sure he has instructed his players on how to properly "eat" a football. (and if the SE players or fans don't know what that means, perhaps that's the problem)
 
This problem pops up every year and it doesn't take rocket science to solve it.

First this a non conference game. I realize the scheduling is done every 2 years and SE is already committed for next year SO the SE AD watches the game next year and if Newman isn't competitive.....they're off the schedule. SE does have a choice whether they play Newman.

Thunder, you stated, "what is SE supposed to do...run dives"? YES! That is exactly what SE should have resorted to doing when even their subs scored on them.

I'm not suggesting that Boone change the mercy rule but I have seen a youth league that their mercy rule is this. The team with the large lead MUST execute running plays only on offense and the plays MUST be between tackles (set position). Any offensive plays outside of the tackles results in an illegal procedure call. When that situation happens the box gets stacked and that is the end of the problem.

Basically running inside running plays have been used by coaches at all levels forever when a game has gotten out of hand and/or a coach wants to kill time and make it be done. Coaches have instructed players NOT to bounce it out but keep it in the middle of the field. It used to be common under the old 50 pt mercy rule for coaches to run dives and avoid scoring to prolong the game and allow kids more play time.

Hind site is always 20/20 but IMO here is what a coach should do.

1. If it really is a mismatch pull the starters before the mercy. If you aren't very deep or have many kids that are physically ready to play varsity then shuffle the kids around and have them play a different position they can safely play. If you are worried your starters aren't getting enough work..let them play defense AND dump the team from your schedule if you can.

2. If your 2nd string and lower scores it is time to play them out of position OR begin running dives. The kids know they can score plus at least they will stay out on the field. If the team being mercied scores then the coach has the option that he can begin running his normal offense again. When you start running dives the other coach will figure it out and likely stack the box.

SE found out it isn't fun for either team when this situation happens but there are definitely things that can be done to put a bad game to rest. It can also still be a learning experience for all. Coach T has control of his players and if he told them to run dives.....they would have.
 
Not a SE fan, but if you don't like getting the crap beat out of you, then do something about it in the offseason! Whining isn't going to get you better. Maybe find the weightroom and post the score in front of your squat rack!
 
Spook, I guess we will just have to disagree. I believe the players did what they were taught to do on a play like that. I would hate to see a kid fall on a ball when it'd the game was on the line.. Live game situations help prepare teams for situations that come later in the season.

Aas much as i disagree with you, I have to give you credit, I took your bait, hook, line and sinker.
 
I want to apologize for my post yesterday. The athletes are just trying to win the game and do what the coaches tell them. Again I am sorry to all!
 
you've been to college alex, its impossible for me to make something out of nothing. something DID happen that's why I was bringing it up. (yet SE would have been better off, if they had just fallen on the ball so nothing had happened)
 
Some people will whine about anything. For crying out loud, if it was a broken play on the PAT, then I could care less that they ultimately got two points. Any player in that situation's first instinct is to score. And when we're talking about JV kids playing in a varsity game, they aren't always prone to suppressing that first instinct due to inexperience/nerves/etc.

Maybe they should have just kneeled on every play. That wouldn't have been embarrassing at all.
 
Originally posted by spook78:

you've been to college alex, its impossible for me to make something out of nothing. something DID happen that's why I was bringing it up. (yet SE would have been better off, if they had just fallen on the ball so nothing had happened)
How about I put it this way.....you are basically stirring the pot to make a big deal about something that wasn't. The Newman coaches weren't offended by it. So I don't know why you're trying to make it sound like anyone else should be........oh wait, that's right.....because you're trying to stir the pot.

P.S. There's a problem with your 12th Commandment. It may be listed as a 2-pt conversion, but SE wasn't attempting to go for 2 to begin with. That's what the try-for-point resulted in because of the missed spot. The way you say it insinuates that it was their intention from the start.
 
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