Dowling ranked #14 in the nation

[DrainTheSwamp]

The Bad Guys are are on the cusp of being a Top 10 team in the country. Thoughts?



I would like to see the IAHSAA Boundary rule lifted. I think it would be good to see Dowling start playing some upper-tier competition like Rockhurst or Bishop Miege in Kansas City or Montini Catholic in Chicago. They're just wasting their time right now playing anyone that isn't Valley...

 

[portpro]

The Bad Guys are are on the cusp of being a Top 10 team in the country. Thoughts?



I would like to see the IAHSAA Boundary rule lifted. I think it would be good to see Dowling start playing some upper-tier competition like Rockhurst or Bishop Miege in Kansas City or Montini Catholic in Chicago. They're just wasting their time right now playing anyone that isn't Valley...

The K.C teams don't match up either, not sure about Montini. Teams like Allen, T.X and Bishop Gorman in Las Vegas are more formidable games! Totally agree the state needs to allow some of our top tier teams to leave the state and play, it would be very good for some of kids and programs to be recognized on a national stage.

 

[DrainTheSwamp]

Bishop Miege D1 Athletes since 2015
Jafar Armstrong-Notre Dame
Dijmon Cobert-Iowa
Colin Grunhard-Notre Dame
Landry Weber-Kansas State
Dawson Downing-Mizzou
Kaelin Key-Kansas State
Ryan Willis-Kansas
Jackson Jenkins-Kansas

Dowling Catholic D1 Athletes since 2015
Peter Nank-Miami (OH)
Ryan Boyle-Iowa
Jake Hummel-Iowa State
Max Morris-Northern Illinois
Nick Wilson-Iowa



Not sure I agree with Dowling Catholic being lightyears better than Miege....

 

[DSMan]

if i remember right, the sioux city schools used to play sd schools 20ish years ago.

My guess is that Dowling would probably win some and lose some against the best midwestern teams (Seton Hall, Olathe, some of the ohio schools) but would probably not get blown out. Once you get to some of the southern states and especially Florida, that's when dowling would probably run into trouble.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

if i remember right, the sioux city schools used to play sd schools 20ish years ago.

My guess is that Dowling would probably win some and lose some against the best midwestern teams (Seton Hall, Olathe, some of the ohio schools) but would probably not get blown out. Once you get to some of the southern states and especially Florida, that's when dowling would probably run into trouble.

I'd err on the low side of the spectrum.....

 

[woodsiding]

Dowling Catholic D1 Athletes since 2015
Peter Nank-Miami (OH)
Ryan Boyle-Iowa
Jake Hummel-Iowa State
Max Morris-Northern Illinois
Nick Wilson-Iowa



[/QUOTE]

I would have sworn that list would be bigger. What happened to all of them, like Brontae Wells, the two Indianola Tailbacks, all of the linebackers, that big TE?

 

[ISUChip]

if i remember right, the sioux city schools used to play sd schools 20ish years ago.

Because they were in the same conference until the South Dakota Ass'n disbanded it around 1997 . East, West, North, Heelan, and 4 Sioux Falls schools (Lincoln, Roosevelt, Washington, O'Gorman.

Same thing for the Council Bluffs schools. They were in an Omaha metro conference, then in another with smaller schools.

 

[Catherine14]

The private school has a definite hold on 4A football in Iowa. No offense, but if you watch those teams from texas, nv play on espn at all, Dowling would have a tough time competing. I got a chance to listen to one of the coaches from Bishop speak about their program and highlights, would not be close.

 

[CIML_Ref]

When does Iowa do an all private school division? Never would be my guess, but I'd bet not many outside of those schools would be sad to see it happen.

 

[woodsiding]

I'd like to see Dowling go full out all-star team. Pull themselves out of IAHSAA and run a schedule all out of state vs some of the best in the midwest. I'd even cheer them on if they did. No need for them not too.

 

[SJM19]

I'd like to see Dowling go full out all-star team. Pull themselves out of IAHSAA and run a schedule all out of state vs some of the best in the midwest. I'd even cheer them on if they did. No need for them not too.

That would definitely help with recruiting. Maybe Nike or Under Armour could sponsor them. Might get a new stadium out of the deal.

 

[GoBigD6788]

How many other private schools does the state of Iowa even have? And that would make it even more lopsided to have Dowling and a bunch of small schools competing against one another.

On the issue of Dowling playing Kansas City metro schools, I can say from being in the Kansas City area for a while, that they'd have trouble competing with Rockhurst and Blue Springs. But they wouldn't have much trouble competing with most Johnson County, Kansas high schools. The Olathe and Shawnee schools are mostly down across the board. High school football on the Missouri side of the metro is better than the Kansas side. Miege never plays any of the "big boys" since they're in Kansas 4A D1 (which is the third class). But that opens a debate much like the Pella one of the past few years.

More importantly, what is it that has made Dowling so dominant in the last 4-5 years?

 

[CIML_Ref]

Dowling, Xavier, Western Christian Hull, Pella Christian, Assumption, Regina, Bishop Heelan, Don Bosco, Mason City Newman, etc. Just going off of schools that I can think of that have played for a state championship in football baseball or basketball in the past few years.

Dowling being able to draw from (and let's be honest, recruit) a metro area of 300,000-400,000 is an unfair advantage. Same can be said for nearly every one of those private schools. They get the cream of the crop from their area. It's high time (in my opinion) for the state to step in and say "Yes, you guys can dominate your conferences with athletes from all of the other member schools, but when the championship season rolls around, you're going to compete with schools that have the same advantage as you." I don't know that this is the best answer, but it's a heck of a lot more fair to every other school in the state. There's no reason that Dowling should be able to compete against the Des Moines metro schools with athletes that live in 7 other schools' district boundaries and we all say "yep, that's fair," with a nod and a wink. /soapbox

 

[oldtimefootball]

Assume this would also apply to SE Polk in wrestling as well? Dowling better gets some new "recruiting staff" quickly as their basketball and wrestling programs sure show no sign of "recruiting". Amazing that a school would spend so much money and time on "recruiting" just one sport....doesn't really seem logical, does it?

 

[ISUChip]

How are you going to set up a private-school football league? 2 classes?

Current football class:
4A - Dowling
3A - Xavier, Assumption, Wahlert, Heelan
2A - Kuemper, Waterloo Columbus, Beckman
1A - Western Christian, Regina, Unity Christian, Pella Christian, DM Christian
A - Garrigan, CB St. Albert, Gehlen, Newman, Grand View Christian
8P - Remsen St. Mary's, Don Bosco, Heartland Christian*
*playing 2 varsity games this year

No football, or shared with other school:
Ankeny Christian Academy, Bellevue Marquette, Trinity Christian, Burlington Notre Dame, Clinton Prince of Peace, Fort Madison Holy Trinity, Iowa Mennonite, Storm Lake St. Mary's, Waterloo Christian, West Branch Scattergood Friends, Iowa Christian Academy, SIouxland Christian

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

Assume this would also apply to SE Polk in wrestling as well? Dowling better gets some new "recruiting staff" quickly as their basketball and wrestling programs sure show no sign of "recruiting". Amazing that a school would spend so much money and time on "recruiting" just one sport....doesn't really seem logical, does it?

Depends on the athletes and if they're specializing......

I know there are places where kids go to schools because of their baseball program even though they are much smaller than nearby schools with better basketball, wrestling, football, etc programs.

Dowling is to football in the DM metro what SE Polk is to wrestling.

 

[cidhawkeye]

Dowling, Xavier, Western Christian Hull, Pella Christian, Assumption, Regina, Bishop Heelan, Don Bosco, Mason City Newman, etc. Just going off of schools that I can think of that have played for a state championship in football baseball or basketball in the past few years.

Dowling being able to draw from (and let's be honest, recruit) a metro area of 300,000-400,000 is an unfair advantage. Same can be said for nearly every one of those private schools. They get the cream of the crop from their area. It's high time (in my opinion) for the state to step in and say "Yes, you guys can dominate your conferences with athletes from all of the other member schools, but when the championship season rolls around, you're going to compete with schools that have the same advantage as you." I don't know that this is the best answer, but it's a heck of a lot more fair to every other school in the state. There's no reason that Dowling should be able to compete against the Des Moines metro schools with athletes that live in 7 other schools' district boundaries and we all say "yep, that's fair," with a nod and a wink. /soapbox

The metro area is far larger than 300-400K. Dowling currently is king, surprised that Valley with the sheer size of their school(a huge advantage) can't compete any better than they do currently. There are schools both public and private that play this game and play it well. Things do run in cycles however.

 

[GoBigD6788]

Dowling, Xavier, Western Christian Hull, Pella Christian, Assumption, Regina, Bishop Heelan, Don Bosco, Mason City Newman, etc. Just going off of schools that I can think of that have played for a state championship in football baseball or basketball in the past few years.

Dowling being able to draw from (and let's be honest, recruit) a metro area of 300,000-400,000 is an unfair advantage. Same can be said for nearly every one of those private schools. They get the cream of the crop from their area. It's high time (in my opinion) for the state to step in and say "Yes, you guys can dominate your conferences with athletes from all of the other member schools, but when the championship season rolls around, you're going to compete with schools that have the same advantage as you." I don't know that this is the best answer, but it's a heck of a lot more fair to every other school in the state. There's no reason that Dowling should be able to compete against the Des Moines metro schools with athletes that live in 7 other schools' district boundaries and we all say "yep, that's fair," with a nod and a wink. /soapbox

There are a number of current varsity football players at other metro schools who actually started out at Dowling either their freshman or sophomore year. But that isn't recruiting for those schools, now is it? As was pointed out, how is it that Dowling only "recruits" for football but haven't done so for any other sports? And what about the 6 straight years that Valley beat Dowling and won a handful of titles? I think too little credit has been given to the program that Tom Wilson has created.

Let's not pretend that Valley and Waukee aren't immense schools or don't also benefit from kids coming from suburban homes.

 

[Catherine14]

Yes you can create a post-season title for private schools. It has been discussed, not happening soon, but more conversation has been occurring in exploring this. Private schools play schools in their area, similar to now in a district, and post season they play for their own title. Makes sense as teams travel for playoffs anyway. This could not happen in-season due to obvious travel expenses, but a valid option in the future for post season.

 

[Drewolson24]

Yes you can create a post-season title for private schools. It has been discussed, not happening soon, but more conversation has been occurring in exploring this. Private schools play schools in their area, similar to now in a district, and post season they play for their own title. Makes sense as teams travel for playoffs anyway. This could not happen in-season due to obvious travel expenses, but a valid option in the future for post season.

Lol, how is a parochial class for postseason a valid option? There is 1 4A private school in the state and 4 in 3A, and the 4 in 3A wouldn't be able to compete with Dowling in most, if not all sports. And what do you do with the lower classes? Do you just let them play against Dowling, Heelan, Assumption and Wahlert too? Dowling has 700-800 more kids than the biggest private 3A and you think it's a valid option and that the other schools could compete? Joke

 

[cidhawkeye]

Lol, how is a parochial class for postseason a valid option? There is 1 4A private school in the state and 4 in 3A, and the 4 in 3A wouldn't be able to compete with Dowling in most, if not all sports. And what do you do with the lower classes? Do you just let them play against Dowling, Heelan, Assumption and Wahlert too? Dowling has 700-800 more kids than the biggest private 3A and you think it's a valid option and that the other schools could compete? Joke

Don't be using facts and logic, their feelings are hurt. The private school multiplier/separate class is their rallying cry except it hasn't delivered the results in other states.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

Don't be using facts and logic, their feelings are hurt. The private school multiplier/separate class is their rallying cry except it hasn't delivered the results in other states.

Are there any really small public schools within a large metro area/city limits?

 

[cidhawkeye]

Are there any really small public schools within a large metro area/city limits?

I am going out on a limb and saying no, unless you count the alternative schools.

 

[Bulldog64]

Lol, how is a parochial class for postseason a valid option? There is 1 4A private school in the state and 4 in 3A, and the 4 in 3A wouldn't be able to compete with Dowling in most, if not all sports. And what do you do with the lower classes? Do you just let them play against Dowling, Heelan, Assumption and Wahlert too? Dowling has 700-800 more kids than the biggest private 3A and you think it's a valid option and that the other schools could compete? Joke

I believe that Xavier, Assumption, and even Heelan has a few titles with roughly the same enrollment

 

[Bulldog64]

I am going out on a limb and saying no, unless you count the alternative schools.

Saydel is probably the smallest

 

[Drewolson24]

I believe that Xavier, Assumption, and even Heelan has a few titles with roughly the same enrollment

When all of them were 4A yes, but they haven't been 4A for years now, Xavier the most recent. The enrollment isn't even close now compared to how it used to be, Dowling 9-11 is 1,038, Xavier-545, Heelan-395, and Assumption even smaller at 316

 

[woodsiding]

There are a number of current varsity football players at other metro schools who actually started out at Dowling either their freshman or sophomore year. But that isn't recruiting for those schools, now is it? As was pointed out, how is it that Dowling only "recruits" for football but haven't done so for any other sports? And what about the 6 straight years that Valley beat Dowling and won a handful of titles? I think too little credit has been given to the program that Tom Wilson has created.

Let's not pretend that Valley and Waukee aren't immense schools or don't also benefit from kids coming from suburban homes.

The bolded part is a stupid argument. Of course catholic kids who want to play football have to leave Dowling because there will be ringers coming in they can't compete with.

Can't argue with the rest of the post. Tom Wilson is notch above the rest and it is not hard to see why kids want to play for him and that program. Your Valley and Waukee examples are spot on too. Lombardi family ending up at Valley in the situations they did should immediately remind you that they are still the biggest player in the recruiting game... As well as the biggest 4A school! Dowling doesn't have advantages on Valley, it's the other way around.

All that said, as a Cedar Rapids guy, we've been pounded by Dowling, but I am glad that our city works differently. We basically play with our own kids (including Xavier).

 

[Bulldog64]

When all of them were 4A yes, but they haven't been 4A for years now, Xavier the most recent. The enrollment isn't even close now compared to how it used to be, Dowling 9-11 is 1,038, Xavier-545, Heelan-395, and Assumption even smaller at 316

I know dynamics in the burbs have changed with an increase in population but Assumption and Xavier were 4a playoff teams and Xavier in the finals just 4 seasons ago when they chose to play up. Just pointing out that they could consistently compete when the played up a class against the likes of Dowling.
If there was a private class, Dowling would have to be excluded since it would be similar to Valley playing Van Meter or something ridiculous like that. Even though the Regals would hold their own but I doubt DM Christian would not.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

I am going out on a limb and saying no, unless you count the alternative schools.

Excellent. That just leaves the small private schools in large metro areas.

 

[scattermanx]

I agree with ciml ref, sjm 19, Catherine and others. There is simply no talent left in any of your public schools. Anyone with any talent is at Dowling. Maybe your public school varsity could play the Catholic grade school teams. That would be more competitive. Or you could encourage boys volleyball at your schools.

 

[cruhawk]

Assume this would also apply to SE Polk in wrestling as well? Dowling better gets some new "recruiting staff" quickly as their basketball and wrestling programs sure show no sign of "recruiting". Amazing that a school would spend so much money and time on "recruiting" just one sport....doesn't really seem logical, does it?

Dowling does recruit. So do all the other metro private schools. That's what they're supposed to do...and how they run their business. That's how they get a significant number of students, much like a college or university. What's wrong with that, and why would they not be willing to "admit" it? It gives them an advantage, as they generally offer a better overall product, academically and athletically, but the public schools still counter that with the advantage of being able to offer a "free" (or at least tuition-free) education.

 

[cruhawk]

When all of them were 4A yes, but they haven't been 4A for years now, Xavier the most recent. The enrollment isn't even close now compared to how it used to be, Dowling 9-11 is 1,038, Xavier-545, Heelan-395, and Assumption even smaller at 316

Heelan's 9-12 is closer to 425-450. Expect that to go up after the new facility is opened up.

 

[SimpsonStorm]

These are computer rankings based on the points scored and points allowed... in no way do they represent the top 25 teams in the country. Look up the rankings and click on the experts rankings. Dowling is no where to be found in those.

 

[Drewolson24]

Heelan's 9-12 is closer to 425-450. Expect that to go up after the new facility is opened up.

Did you not see I said 9-11? That means 9-12 would be somewhere around 500-520.

 

[Drewolson24]

Heelan's 9-12 is closer to 425-450. Expect that to go up after the new facility is opened up.

And why do you think that number will change at Heelan? New school doesn't change any athletic facilities other than basketball, which if you ask anyone I think they'd rather play in the pit since it has such a home court advantage and its unique. Not like a plain public school HS gym.

 

[volknut]

Assume this would also apply to SE Polk in wrestling as well? Dowling better gets some new "recruiting staff" quickly as their basketball and wrestling programs sure show no sign of "recruiting". Amazing that a school would spend so much money and time on "recruiting" just one sport....doesn't really seem logical, does it?

It does when it is the money maker for the majority of schools. Much like college's football rules the roost.

 

[cruhawk]

Did you not see I said 9-11? That means 9-12 would be somewhere around 500-520.

No. I meant to say that 9-11 is 425-450. Which is accurate.

9-12 is actually 575-600.

 

[cruhawk]

And why do you think that number will change at Heelan? New school doesn't change any athletic facilities other than basketball, which if you ask anyone I think they'd rather play in the pit since it has such a home court advantage and its unique. Not like a plain public school HS gym.

If you can't see why a new academic (not just athletic) facility would result in an increase in numbers (something that has been projected for a number of years now), I'm not sure you can be helped.

 

[Drewolson24]

No. I meant to say that 9-11 is 425-450. Which is accurate.

9-12 is actually 575-600.

Lol no it is not. Where are you getting these numbers from? Last year, (2016-17) 9-12 enrollment was 523. I know that the 2021 class is not 170-180 kids to make that 575-600.
And as for the building, and an increase in numbers, where would the kids come from? What's the desire to transfer to Heelan from North, West, East or SB-L right now? Just cause there is a new school won't all of a sudden make people want to pay 8k a year.

 

[Catherine14]

Drewolson, obviously you get really impacted by statements on these threads pertaining to private schools. You need to relax a little and realize these are opinions and not always facts. If we all looked at the state of football in Iowa, the gap between good, not even excellent teams, and poor teams is getting bigger every year. Coaches around the state, as well as school admin, try to find a way to keep these schools fielding a team and staying as competitive as possible. If these schools keep losing by 50 through a majority of their games, eventually their program will be gone. Question is how to balance that and not keep losing numbers. Besides all the concussion issues surrounding football, there are just less athletes period in sports as less kids are willing to put in the time expected by coaches. Who wants to get beat by 50 every other week when they could be hanging out with friends and not go through practice in 90 degree heat in August.