What if there was a multiplier?

[AlecJensen89]

Teams that would change class because of a enrollment multiplier.

Up to 4A: Xavier, Wahlert, Heelan

Up to 3A: Beckman, Columbus, Unity Christian, Western Christian

Up to 2A: Newman, Garrigan, Gehlan, Notre Dame, Don Bosco

More even playing field? More or less the same? Unfair for Private Schools?

 

[cidhawkeye]

Good to see this subject has moved off of the football boards for now. Should be some interesting comments I am sure. I did notice that my local private school has their 'accepting students' sign up in their yard so the recruiting talk can start.

 

[teamlessfan]

Interesting..... I'm not in TOTAL agreement of a multiplier. I think it discriminates. I believe the real issue to be SES. Statistically, LSES kids aren't playing sports. I've seen studies that suggest as low as 2% and as high as 6%. I'd like to see someone recalculate and classify each school based on the Minnesota system. Minn. subtracts 40% of your free and reduced lunch from your enrollment for the purpose of classification.

 

[AlecJensen89]

I multiplied each schools enrollment by 1.6 like Illinois does.

 

[cidhawkeye]

Illinois does it for all non boundary schools public and private. To apply that system to Iowa all schools would get multiplied based on open enrollment. So nobody would move if the Illinois system was in place here.

 

[ORSKY1]

Burlington ND has been in 2A for the last 4years by choice.

 

[wolverine55]

I just sort of laugh every time this topic comes up on this board. As stated above, Iowa's open enrollment policy makes comparing this issue to what other states do apples and oranges...

 

[brewcrewman1]

I totally agree with wolverine. Open enrollment in Iowa makes the "mickey mouse" idea of using a multiplier a moot point. Find something else to discuss As an Example: follow the Girl's Union's lead when it comes to assigning teams to districts in basketball to hopefully..yes HOPEFULLY...get the best teams to the State Tournament in basketball. or as another Example..should perhaps they allow a wildcard team in the state basketball tournament. Nebraska in basketball has 7 qualifiers and 1 wild card team it could be 6 district champs and 2 wildcard teams either way at least one of the 8 is a wildcard entry. This way if two exceptional teams are "stuck" in the same District perhaps the losing team can still advance if that teams criteria is better than everyone else of those who did not become an automatic qualifier. This follows the NCAA Basketball Championships profile to a degree...Automatic Conf. Tournament Champ gets into the "brackets" the others get picked as a wild card. In Iowa HS Boys Basketball...say 6 or 7 substate winner's make the state tournament while 1 or 2 are picked as wildcard/at-large teams based on a set of criteria.

 

[AlecJensen89]

Okay throw everything that ive said in this topic. Who should've made the tournement?

 

[cidhawkeye]

I don't want to sound to obvious but I am going with the teams that won their sub state games. The boys side does not do as good of a job with their assignments as they do on the girls side but it is the current system. It doesn't feel good when it happens but you can get a tough draw. In high school for me it was getting the #1 team in our substate when we were a top 10 team as well. We just needed to be better, in an an ironic twist we lost to a private school from a metropolitan area.... Dang private schools.

 

[AlecJensen89]

The 1A and 2A brackets look fine to me and the teams that got there. Are you making a case about the 3A or 4A brackets?

 

[DogBoyRy]

Dowling would go to 6A and be awarded the championship in every sport.

 

[cyard31]

Mr. Obivous,
what is this talk of "getting better" I thought the discussion was based on changing things so everybody gets a trophy???

 

[cidhawkeye]

It is a rare concept that used to be the mindset. When a team beat you the goal was to get better, not to try and make the other team get worse. Sort of like well before your time we were the smallest school in the conference, playing teams that were two classes larger, trying to get better. Doesn't play well these days.

 

[mvcdbqfan]

Let's not forget to look at the other end of the spectrum. Which teams in 4A move down to 3A? I am guessing teams like West Dubuque would move down to 3A?

 

[Hawksfolife]

So why would it be fair for Dubuque Wahlert to play up to Class 4-A and Western Dubuque to play down into class 3-A, when Western Dubuque has the larger enrollment? I see absolutely no sense in that what so ever.

 

[cidhawkeye]

Are you waiting for the "recruiting, don't have to accept everyone, no special ed, low level of discounted lunches" answer?
Sorry left out the two parent home, money to go to camp, being located in a metropolitan area....blah, blah, blah.

 

[AlecJensen89]

Are you trying to say these things don't happen?

 

[Pinehawk]

Originally posted by Hawksfolife:
So why would it be fair for Dubuque Wahlert to play up to Class 4-A and Western Dubuque to play down into class 3-A, when Western Dubuque has the larger enrollment? I see absolutely no sense in that what so ever.

If a team has prolonged failure in a certain class, why not move them down to make things more competitive? It makes as much sense as moving teams up in an attempt to make things more competitive.

 

[rogerfrank]

Why are you picking on private schools because they are good and public school suck. What about schools like Bettendorf in football and Danville in basketball and iowa city west. About these schools they so much better than rest of teams they seem to be always making it to state. Should they bd punished for being good? Oh wait they are public schools so that is ok. So just quit hating on private schools and tell those lazy ass public school kids to take pride in their schools and step up and put in the time and effort to excel.

 

[AlecJensen89]

But schools like Dowling and Regina are also going and actually winning the whole thing though.

 

[cyard31]

When you say "Schools Like" -- you mean the privates teams winning and not the privates not doing so well?

 

[AlecJensen89]

Yeah because Dowling, Hempstead, Xavier, wahlert, heelan, assumption, beckman, western Christian, unity Christian, pella Christian, st Edmond, gehlan are not doing well.

 

[cyard31]

Do these get a negative multiplier to move them down a class? Holy Trinity, IMS, Columbus, Notre Dame, St. Mary's Remsen, St. Mary's Storm Lake, Maquette Catholic, Cedar Valley Christian, Prince of Peace, Valley Luth.

 

[cidhawkeye]

Snap..... I might also add that there are rumblings that a kid moved into an apartment in a neighboring community and played varsity basketball for two teams in the same season.

 

[Hawksfolife]

So just because Dubuque Wahlert is a private school they will have to try to compete against WDM Valley and other schools that are 5 times as big as them. Dont see any logic in that.

 

[AlecJensen89]

Maybe since the girls athletic union is so good they should have 5 classes like them?
This post was edited on 4/2 12:48 AM by AlecJensen89

 

[AlecJensen89]

Notre Dame went (19-4) for bball. Another thing, most of the schools you listed really wouldn't even be effected by the multiplier because they have such a low enrollment. Did you just list all the other private schools that I didn't say? lol

 

[cyard31]

yes, trying to help you "pick & choose" Please feel free to pick the successful publics also.
Notre Dame, ya look at the teams they played LOL

 

[mvcdbqfan]

This post was edited on 4/2 9:22 AM by mvcdbqfan

 

[mvcdbqfan]

Hawksfolife posted on 4/1/2015...

So just because Dubuque Wahlert is a private school they will have to try to compete against WDM Valley and other schools that are 5 times as big as them. Dont see any logic in that.

Using the above statement, is there any logic in a school like Wahlert competing in the Mississippi Valley? Many of the schools in the Valley are 3-4 times as big as Wahlert, yet Wahlert still competes, and competes well, against these schools?

 

[AlecJensen89]

Pick and Choose? The schools that are not doing very well wouldn't even be effected so there's that.

 

[cidhawkeye]

Perhaps so they can get better for the post season? Perhaps there are some schools that aren't successful and wouldn't be successful even if they had 4,000 students? A myriad of reasons.

Perhaps the answer is 10 classes, that way a great majority of kids can say they played in the state tournament, the schools can get their participation banners and people can roll their eyes and look at them and say "back in my day going to state meant something" and the people who want to hand out the orange slices and medals can look at them and say 'but think of their self esteem'

Get the rules changed and if you can't do that figure out a way to get better or tip your hat to those who are better.

 

[WhiteShadowHoops]

Whatever happened to getting so good that you can't lose? Why are there so many boo hoo excuses from losers? Do you think those Palmer teams in the 80s cared about multipliers when their small school selves won 100+ straight games? You mad about some other team winning and things not being fair? Get in the gym with your team this off-season and demand excellence. Enough of the cheese and whine parties.

 

[DogBoyRy]

Competes well?
Please in what sport except bball?

 

[AlecJensen89]

Do want private schools that compete well in other things that basketball? Dowling, Regina, St Eds, Don Bosco, Heelan, Beckman, Xavier, Garrigan, Newman, Gehlan, Hempstead.

 

[EastIowaHawk]

Dub. Hempstead is a public school with a four-year enrollment of about 1800 students.

 

[AlecJensen89]

Sorry I don't know why I have been saying them.