Posted this on 3A board

[Kraftwerk]

I’m from Sioux City and it is painfully obvious the MRAC outside of SBL cannot compete at the 4A level and hasn’t for over a decade. The 3A schools are pretty solid over here and could beat a good % of 4A and be competitive with some 4A’s best. I don’t know about the rest of the state, that’s why I’m asking you guys.

If you combine 3A and 4A, the games will become much more competitive and you will greatly reduce travel. I know some of you are going to mention 3A schools that have very low # of students but I believe that does not matter much at all because for example Sioux City community schools are nearly half minority in the elementary and middle school grades. Also household income is very low compared to 3A communities. What do you think about this? It would be a drastic change but maybe for the better. The other idea I’d look to next is doing a A class and a B class like the Europeans do for the champion’s league soccer, where if you’re at the top of the class you play others at the top and the lesser teams in the bottom class, with teams changing back and forth each year. Combining programs should be avoided, it will start a chain reaction and eventually lead to one football class with no individual high school being represented.

 

[mtdew_fever]

Another question could be posed. Is winning state titles the only reason why a school should offer a sport such as football?

Would that be better if Sioux City schools could drop down to 3A so they can get beat up in the Dome by Xavier, Solon or Western Dubuque?

 

[Reasoned]

Yeah, I’m generally opposed to changing the class format (this would include for socioeconomic reasons) under the guise of making things more ”competitive” for the less invested.

 

[JansenMustGo]

Another question could be posed. Is winning state titles the only reason why a school should offer a sport such as football?

Would that be better if Sioux City schools could drop down to 3A so they can get beat up in the Dome by Xavier, Solon or Western Dubuque?

Sioux City schools would have worse record in 3A given they play mainly each other and pathetic Council Bluffs schools. 4A football in Des Moines is different but around Sioux City it would be worse for them in another class. At least now they can play each other and the strongest of the weak gets to beat their chest for a week. The one good Council Bluffs school they dodge as well.

 

[Kraftwerk]

Another question could be posed. Is winning state titles the only reason why a school should offer a sport such as football?

Would that be better if Sioux City schools could drop down to 3A so they can get beat up in the Dome by Xavier, Solon or Western Dubuque?

Yeah, I’m generally opposed to changing the class format (this would include for socioeconomic reasons) under the guise of making things more ”competitive” for the less invested.

Yeah, I’m generally opposed to changing the class format (this would include for socioeconomic reasons) under the guise of making things more ”competitive” for the less invested.

Sioux City schools would have worse record in 3A given they play mainly each other and pathetic Council Bluffs schools. 4A football in Des Moines is different but around Sioux City it would be worse for them in another class. At least now they can play each other and the strongest of the weak gets to beat their chest for a week. The one good Council Bluffs school they dodge as well.

It’s not just to make games more competitive, it’s also to reduce travel time and increase attendance.

 

[woodsiding]

Yeah, I’m generally opposed to changing the class format (this would include for socioeconomic reasons) under the guise of making things more ”competitive” for the less invested.

This is one of the more ignorant posts I've read in a long time. A guy like Coach Sabers at City High isn't 'invested' in football? That's BS. He's every bit the coach now that he has been and probably more. Now a days there are a lot of schools where recruiting your own halls is full time job trying to put a team on the field. But no, there is no difference between them and Bettendorf.

 

[Reasoned]

This is one of the more ignorant posts I've read in a long time. A guy like Coach Sabers at City High isn't 'invested' in football? That's BS. He's every bit the coach now that he has been and probably more. Now a days there are a lot of schools where recruiting your own halls is full time job trying to put a team on the field. But no, there is no difference between them and Bettendorf.

How is opposition to combining two classes with a total of 96 schools, ranging from 2200-350 in enrollments 9-11 “ignorant”? Look, there’s no doubt that parity in high school football is declining, it’s been declining. There was a time when a talented class of kids coming through a school could compete and win but there are now programs in the state (primarily in Des Moines in 4A) which have become completely dominant. I’m all for wanting to have more competitive games throughout the state but as long as there are schools which focus more resources on having a winning program, they will. As far as the comment about the City High program, of course Coach Sabers is invested in his program, as is Coach Hartwig at West but the opening of Liberty has most certainly affected those programs.

 

[franky1967]

This is a fact, I will point out. The Iowa Athletic Association has ruined High School Football.

It starts with the playoff system and implementing a retarded RPI system, for one that does not follow through with the way it was intended and for two, does not belong in high school football.

In 4a, you now have lost the balance that was there in years past where at least 8/8 from each side of the state made the playoffs. Now you can have a imbalance of 10/6.

The State had it right when they had a 32 team playoff field. Now I think they could have tweaked that down to 24 and got it right.

Who wants to play football if you are pretty sure you won't play in a playoff game? What player just wants to play 9 games and call it a season.

I don't want to hear, that it is the money, the coaches, the program and all the crap that comes with it. If you don't have players going out consistently then none of that matters.


The Iowa Athletic Association needs to pull their heads out of their butt and restore football to at least 24team playoff field. Quit trying to regionalize football into 4 regions and let some other teams at least have a chance to do what SE Polk did last year

 

[screwloose]

There's an imbalance in "West/East ratio in 4A, because the old line of splitting those teams is now 24/18. That breaks down to 4/3. Doubles to 8/6. Basically leaving two spots to be up for grabs. Could be 8/8, 9/7 or 10/6. That ratio is simple mathematics.

 

[franky1967]

There's an imbalance in "West/East ratio in 4A, because the old line of splitting those teams is now 24/18. That breaks down to 4/3. Doubles to 8/6. Basically leaving two spots to be up for grabs. Could be 8/8, 9/7 or 10/6. That ratio is simple mathematics.

All that maybe true and can change from year to year. However, they had the system almost right when they had a 32 field. 24 team field with a 1st round bye would have been better.

They can keep on trying to make Iowa the model of High School Football (which never going to happen) or they can solve the problem of declining numbers and weak programs.

Honestly, I don't understand why they don't have a consolation playoffs for the other 16teams that don't make the playoffs. .

Why does every sport in High school let you play in post season but football?

 

[tnobd]

It has been a long time since I have posted here. But it is apparent there is a wider gap in competiveness between the 4A schools then even a decade ago. It includes more than the Des Moines, Sioux City, Council Bluffs Metro schools. It involves the isolated 4A public schools..the only exceptions are Ft Dodge, Muscatine and maybe an improved Marshalltown. I read the article with the Des Moines Lincoln coach comments from the other board. Success is absolutely about participation and development. It is easier to maintain the large rosters at the suburban schools with their resources and parents resources and very difficult at the regular public high schools. But the one point I noticed was the perception of winning..it is hard to ask a kid to join a program when it is perceived that will not win at least half their games or 5 games in Iowa prep football. I am guessing a lot of the players at the metro levels have no parents or even grandparent that can recall that football used to be a rite of passage. It was a source of community pride and for blue collar kids even in the metro areas it was an equalizer for the players in life. You could work hard on the field and be highly regarded by your peers no matter what your folks did. As that article said, socioeconomics is effecting prep football in many states. The IHSAA has to address the resources and coaching disparity issues or they will continue to lose players. I don't think the successful suburban schools want to to increase their travel budgets to play in other cities no more than a metro school wants play rural 3A schools. I would allow 4A districts that have all the metro schools grouped together and allow those schools to play isolated 4A programs they have been competitive with. I can see prep football being replaced by other sports in the future unless the participation issues are addressed.

 

[Reasoned]

Interesting post, IMHO if you want to address the issues of competitiveness and participation there needs to be honesty in discussing what the causes are and if there’s any ability to do something about it. Having attended several 4A games this year, I have been appalled not only by the lack of player participation (this is not a new trend) but more concerning, the lack of parental participation. As an example, one school ( which will remain unnamed), had brought not only zero students but I counted fewer than two dozen adults in attendance! The weather was fine, yes there was an hour plus travel but still, I’ve see our school have more adults attending a freshman game 1 1/2 hours away in inclement weather. So the point is, this is what is meant by being invested in the program. If parents don’t support, students don’t participate in playing or watching, is there any wonder the coaches/administrators don’t either? So what can/should be done with these programs? Change the PO format so they can play one more game and get blown out, or change the class structure to haves vs have nots ( not just socioeconomics) but play strength? Not sure what the answers are but I only see the lack of parity and participation getting worse.