Ha, Ha, Meeks...

[MitchL]

No, not for being a meddling parent, but Mr. Meeks has issued a blanket apology on the Iowa wrestling forum for all the disparaging remarks he has made over the last few years about Dan Gable, TnT Brands, and the Iowa wrestling program, in general. Sorry, I am not good at posting links, but it brings up a multitude of questions with the timing and motivation to post such a humiliating admission.

One could theorize that it may be a early attempt to mend fences because of the tenuous situation in Cloneville. In the likely event that this is Kevin Jackson's last season in Ames, could Mr. Meeks be planting the seeds for an eventual transfer out of ISU for his son?

The timing is certainly curious, to say the least. And it may be simply a coincidence that the current 141 at Iowa will be a senior this fall and thus there will be a new 141 for the 2015/2016 season in Iowa City.

A new coaching staff would most certainly review the current scholly situation and $$$ allotment for the current wrestling roster at ISU. And you can bet your right arm that a 500, or less wrestler, isn't going to be getting anything close to a full ride. In reality, the pressure will be immense for young John for the upcoming season. Given that 141 is absolutely STACKED this next year, the prospects for an AA season are basically nonexistent for young John.

It goes without saying that the Meeks' family will deny everything, but this is just plain odd that Mr. Meeks would do this.

I wish nothing but good luck to all Iowa high school wrestling stars, John included, but I think the eventual destination for him will be GV.

 

[buf87]

You don't have a clue

 

[MitchL]

buf:

I realize you are a very passionate ISU fan and have periodic discussions with wrestlers and some parents. I also know from reading numerous forums that there is a high degree of apathy concerning long time ISU fans and that the bar has been set incredibly low regarding the expectation of Jackson coached teams.

When I first started following college wrestling in the late 80s, ISU was always in the discussion regarding team titles. While everyone realizes ISU got hosed by CS, KJ has had five years to restore respectability. I don't call a 4th, 5th and an 8th restoring respectability at a school with the history and tradition of ISU.

Mr. Meeks has been a lightning rod for criticism since the day John committed to ISU. No parent should get involved, post, or even read message boards. Yet, Mr. Meeks has been about the most outspoken parent I have ever seen. His previous hatred towards the U of I is well documented.

Now whether John finishes his career at ISU remains to be seen. But, and that's a BIG but, if there is an eventual coaching change in Ames, I really doubt the scholly agreement that Keith INSINUATED the family got when John enrolled, will be what the family likes with a new staff.

I don't know all the facts. You likely don't either. But message boards are where opinions are stated and sometimes discussed.

The one thing I am willing to do is make a small non-money wager. I will cease posting about ISU wrestling if John Meeks attains AA status next season at 141. Given the returning talent for next season, can you honestly predict that JM will achieve that degree of success?

My prediction of him eventually ending up at Grandview was indeed sarcasm, tho. And there is also no way in hell that Tom Brands would want the headache of Keith Meeks around his program, in any way, shape, or form.

Meeks at Iowa? That ship sailed a long time ago.

So to correct slightly... I do have a clue!

 

[Saints85]

I suggest taking 2 hours out of your day and watch Anger Management if you haven't already viewed it. If so, maybe seek some professional help. To be honest with you MitchL, some things you say, I agree with. But this HATRED you have for the Meeks needs some serious addressing. If they have spoken unfavorable about the Iowa program and coaches, that is for the coaches to deal with. LET IT GO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[MitchL]

I wouldn't call it hatred. Rather it is objective criticism of a very outspoken individual.

See, the problem with some parents and athletes is that they crave the attention and the adulation, because many have been coddled by coaches over time, yet some fans and others get upset when said individuals become bitter and resentful when things go south.

There have been countless high school stars that fizzled at the collegiate level. For many different reasons. The biggest problem at ISU recently has been the lack of QUALITY workout partners and a head coach that never dealt with 18-19 year old athletes. Jackson's history was working with post collegiate wrestlers before his arrival in Ames.

Now granted... he was the 4th or 5th choice by some accounts, but with the fan support and resources that ISU has/had, it's puzzling how that program could sink to this level of irrelevance.

So I will continue to state objective opinions about things occurring in Ames. And as you can see from other threads, I have made comments that were also less than complimentary regarding the Hawks.

It's what the forums are about. No personal animosity but merely something which others may or may not choose to discuss.

 

[oonfoofoo]

You sir are an idiot. Nothing you say on any posts can just justify the headline of this thread. Ha, ha.

What I would suggest to you is to put your name, address and phone number on here for the Meeks family to get in touch with you.

Again, you sir are an idiot

 

[MitchL]

Nice 2nd post! Have a great day Mrs. Meeks!

I don't give opinions to try and gain someone's positive approval. I simply state my thoughts on a subject. It's for others to either agree or disagree. Fact is... this sounds a little like something OldMC would say back in the day. He liked to act like the internet tough guy too and threaten physical violence. He couldn't win an discussion and that was his outlet.

These forums are pretty slow in the off season.

Listen... it's no secret that Daddy Meeks and Kevin Jackson made a HUGE mistake by having John wrestle as a true freshman. You need to look no further than the career to date of Cory Clark to realize absolutely everything I have stated on this subject is SPOT ON.

If I was an ISU fan, I'd hope for a good season for young John next winter, but the odds are stacked pretty heavily against that happening. Just the reality of that situation.

 

[IAChedda]

I haven't ever weighed in on the issue but from what I've read and then thinking of the old adage "what goes around, comes around" I think quite possibly we are in the stage of "goes around"

 

[MitchL]

Thanks, Chedda! That was EXACTLY my point regarding the apology. Why now? After 2-3 years? Makes very little sense unless he has some ulterior motive.

Unfortunately, the Meeks' apologists have chosen to avoid any discussion as to why he did this. Rather it is apparently easier to try and change the subject into something about me, personally, which is immaterial to the original topic.

 

[oonfoofoo]

Like I said....put your name to this thread.

Sounds to me like somewhere along the line the MitchL boy was beated badly by Mr. Meeks and is looking for some way to get back at him. Face it man, your kid wasn't, isn't and will never be the wrestler the Meeks was, is or will be.

 

[buf87]

I know why he posted the apology. And like I said, you don't have a clue. It has nothing to do with Iowa State, John Meeks, or transferring. Keith does not need to explain why he did it. It was a nice gesture and done for the right reasons. You don't need to read into it and make it something it is not.

 

[MitchL]

This whole issue with the past hatred that Mr. Meeks expressed for the Hawk program and individuals involved with the Iowa program never needed to happen.

If Mr. Meeks would have came out and admitted that, from a financial standpoint, the family NEEDED a full ride, all this would have been a non issue. But I suspect it was more of a "pride" issue. You know... "My son is THAT good and he deserves a full ride". Obviously, Jackson gave the family what they wanted.

Where Mr. Meeks made his mistake was when he tried getting the public to buy into this remark... and I'm paraphrasing here... "Iowa State and their coaching staff give John the best chance to achieve his personal goals as a wrestler and student". No one in their right mind could believe such a statement! The ISU staff at the time hadn't shown any ability, whatsoever, to do that. The trail of transfers and failed jucos are proof of that.

So buf.. continue to defend ISU! You are a great fan of the Clones. But the objective wrestling fan knows the Jackson regime has been a giant, underwhelming part of the tradition and glory of ISU wrestling...by anyone's standard.

 

[MitchL]

BTW: This to "oonfoofoo". I never had a son to be able to say I had a son that wrestled. So save that garbage insinuating I'm somehow jealous of the Meeks' clan.

And not every high school star succeeds at the D-1 collegiate level. With a personal trainer/coach thru his high school years, I suspect young John had a tremendous advantage over his opponents. He's in college now, and that advantage is a part of history. Now it's all about his training/workout partners and a college coaching staff. Given the present situation in Ames... I'd say it's a pretty big stretch to predict future success for him.

As a supporter of Iowa high school wrestling... I'd hope he's someday able to achieve AA status. But given the projected guys at 141 next season, he may have trouble even qualifying for Nationals.

 

[Saints85]

Read the apology and posts that followed. As disappointing as MitchL can be, as an ISU Alum, I applaud the 99% of Hawkeye fans that addressed Mr. Meeks with positive responses. The vast majority want John to succeed, accepted the apology, and considered it water under the bridge. They showed class, and quite frankly, showed me a side of Iowa fans that I haven't seen before. I threw in the towel, when Cael jumped ship, and Iowa became my 2nd favorite wrestling team. The posts that were made reaffirmed my decision. I cannot let knobs like MitchL taint those feelings. He will respond with how poor ISU has been the past couple years. He will point to the many faults the Meeks family has made. For some reason, he just cannot let it go. That is his demon he must "wrestle" with. ISU is a bad place. No one can argue against that. What was once a top notch, title contending program, is no where near that level. It is disappointing to say the least. The positive I can take away from it is that it is providing a level of entertainment for MitchL.

 

[MitchL]

I'm still quite mystified by why and why now! And buf... please don't respond with that reply that I would expect from an eight year old girl. You know... "I know ,but I'm not telling". That one.

The ISU fan base, yeah, all 17 of them, are likely wondering the same thing as I am.

BTW: "Saints", you're a lousy fan to throw in the towel just because ISU stinks. Grow a pair and make your voice heard. It might take more than 13,000 empty seats to make Pollard take notice that the wrestling program needs new direction. ISU isn't the first school to have a head coach leave. VTech didn't fold the tent when Brands came back to Iowa and they sure as hell didn't have the tradition of ISU.

Blame me for piling on the ISU train wreck all you want. Better yet... make an effort to do what you can to change things in Ames.

Here's the thing... when you are short on talent AND bodies in the room... you absolutely DO NOT throw a full ride at one kid. That's not a difficult concept to grasp. Not with 9.9!

 

[Saints85]

Didn't throw the towel in on the program, threw the towel in as far as never cheering for the Hawks and wanting my rival to lose. I am not a booster nor former ISU athlete, so I don't think Mr. Pollard would listen to anything I have to say. You seem to have all the answers, who would you hire? What scholarship offers would you make. Lastly, just took a piss before I got on here, stones are both there and doing fine.

 

[MitchL]

Thanks for your honesty!

I'll try and answer as many of your questions as I can.

1-Pollard has a financial issue right now. ISU has been unfortunate over the years with having to pay coaches who are no longer actively coaching at ISU. The die hard ISU fans know of whom I speak. KJ has one year left on his contract, from what I understand. So he's safe until next March. But anything less than top 10 and he's history. Given the team points returning from this year and those barely outside the top ten... ISU is not a top ten team next year

Translation... HE Gone!

2- There are/were guys out there that I think would be interested. One is gone now. I see where Pritzlaf signed with Rutgers as head asst. Heskett has always been my favorite, but there are rumors he wants an administrative job. Mark Perry I believe wants to stay in the B1G. The only obvious prospects right now within the ISU "family" would be the Paulsens', but they are still competing. I think Varner might work, maybe Reader, but likewise, still competing.

There are always some dark horses. Pollard should have pulled the plug 2 years ago. The coaching pool for the ISU job is shrinking because every year you continue to suck, the rebuild job becomes bigger.

As far as recruiting goes... high school studs want to go to successful programs or a school with a dynamic coach. ISU has neither. That's why the longer ISU takes to replace KJ, the harder it is to recruit good kids. If you don't believe me... how many top tier schools have lost a kid they wanted to ISU? Recently, I can't think of one. At least a kid that wasn't a "legacy" recruit or a kid that already had some connection to ISU.

This has gotten kind of long. Sorry on that, but you get my point.



This post was edited on 5/2 4:30 PM by MitchL

 

[Saints85]

thx

 

[MitchL]

It looks like Dannan must be afraid that ISU might be coming after Schwab given the nice new contract he just received. That is one of those situations where Pollard could REALLY, REALLY energize the fan base with that type of hire.

There have also been rumblings that Minnesota might even take a look at Doug S.

If, and it's a BIG if, KJ keeps his job after another ho-hum season, then it would signal to me that Pollard is not interested in the wrestling program and ISU will ride the Hoiberg WAVE for all it can bring to ISU.

The success of MBB at ISU has taken a lot of focus off the tumbling football program and the problems that ISU wrestling has experienced.

 

[Saints85]

Right or wrong, I would argue about the fball situation. I obviously can't justify their record is worthy of a positive conversation, but the stadium is full almost every home game. Fball is the cash cow and pays for many of the other sports. Will this trend continue with similar wins and losses, doubtfull, but they are bringing in bigtime $. Funny you brought up Schwab, that was going to be my suggestion. I think we need a bigger name than what you suggested. I have wondered, for some time, if Terry would ever cross lines for a head job.

 

[MitchL]

It was supposedly common knowledge that Terry was the very first person Pollard contacted when Cael left. He makes head coach $$$ without all the head aches right now. The hatred at ISU for the Brands Bros would have been interesting if Terry had been interested.

Timing is key. I'm no expert, but I follow collegiate wrestling very closely. Guess I have too much time on my hands. If ISU truly wants a return to being a National Title contender, then KJ needs to be replaced. Pure and simple.

He has not shown the ability to bring in elite NATIONAL recruits. You could argue he hasn't developed the talent in the room. And before I get blasted... Jon Reader would have been a Champ with or without KJ.

ISU needs that big time splash you speak of. Outside of the ISU alumni, I just don't know who that is. Eric Guerrero? Everyone of the head coaches that finished ahead of ISU this year are all at good programs. Any good coach in the B1G isn't leaving. The B1G is a magnet.

Like I said earlier... my opinion is that after the St. Louis flop where ISU had no AAs, that was the time to pull the plug.

 

[oonfoofoo]

Again, you're an idiot. Hmm, you are right - not everyone succeeds and idiots like you are there to drag them down. I tell my kid this every day "there are idiots out there just waiting for you to screw up" and you are that person. As for Meeks' advantages over his opponents...yup you're right. His advantage was he was better than them - I think to the tune of 168 times.

As for your jealousy - then you should have put the topic as "Meeks father issues apologies" not Ha, Ha. So take your "see he's not as good as everyone thought" attitude and stop by the meeks household.

And as for your line "I'd hope he's someday able to achieve AA status" is full of crap and no you don't otherwise you would have said he will wind up at Grandview...which by the way isn't so bad.


And can you recommend a good stock that will perform well so I can shift a little money around as you seem to have a pretty good crystal ball.

 

[MitchL]

I've seen people like you before in life who have trouble dealing with reality. Rather than trying to have an intelligent discussion about a subject, they resort to name calling and their responses become rants. That "you're an idiot" response only proves your intellectual short comings.

Now back to the subject... time will tell if young John succeeds at the collegiate level. It's obvious that he has struggled mightily to this point. I think in a different program with better coaches he could do well.

I've come to the conclusion that you are either close friends with the Meeks' family or are a relative. I can see how you'd take exception with my honest opinions. For that, I apologize.

But these forums are for fans to express themselves without personally attacking individuals. ISU's wrestling program is a mess. Not exactly some well kept secret. But fortunately, young John has the privilege to have at least a part of his college education paid thru a scholarship. Ten years from now, no one will care what his college wrestling credentials were. Hopefully his college experience will have been time well spent.

 

[buf87]

Iowa State program is a mess and we place ahead of UNI at the NCAA the last 2 years, but UNI just gives Schwab a 7 year extension for doing such a great job. This should have been UNIs big year at Nationals.

 

[MitchL]

Buf:

Just a few comments since you've suddenly chosen to take a jab at UNI. All the momentum is trending for UNI. Schwab has already displayed the ability to coach up his guys. Something that is seriously lacking in Ames. Dannen realized what he has and the contract extension shows that.

And yes... ISU is a mess. It's just that the fan apathy is so obvious that you don't hear much positive about things going forward at ISU. The leaders at ISU, Moreno and Gadsen, are both seniors next season. The young guys at ISU aren't creating much buzz. Consequently, UNI has Peters and Moore as studs who are going to be YOUNG leaders for them.

Now think about that for a moment and then tell me again which school has a brighter future??? You seriously made me suspect of your objectivity with your last post.

But hey... you have that big secret that you won't share about the Meeks' motive.

I 'll bet you a good amount of money that 95% of real ISU fans would take Schwab over KJ in a heartbeat.

Your loyalty to ISU is blinding your thought process.

 

[buf87]

Why should I or would I share the reason Mr Meeks apologized? If you are that curious ask him.

As far as developing, what is happening with Krumweide at UNI, wasn't he a top ranked recruit out of high school? What happen to Loder this year, injuries?

Funny when Spangler and Sorenson got hurt, it was coaching and technique.

I am not happy with where Iowa State is, but your hatred towards Iowa State or KJ blinds you from discussing it, so it is irrelevant discussing it with you any further. I know the problems at Iowa State.

 

[MitchL]

BuF:

I am good friends with several people that are long time Cyclone fans. They are simply disgusted with how ISU has fallen from relevance. After that debacle in St. Louis, they wanted KJ gone. I think subconsciously, they were willing to see what KJ would do with a team full of HIS recruits. Well... in his 5th season, he has an 8th, 5th, and 4th. That's five years and not a sniff to be in the top ten at Nationals. We both know that ISU isn't even considered to be anywhere close to a top five program.

Harold Nichols must be rolling over in his grave. ISU fans and their "injury" excuses(Sorenson/Beard/Spangler) are a lame attempt to deflect criticism. Every top team in the country has had injury issues at some point.

Now to address your latest slam against UNI. A little lesson, free of charge. UNI qualified a Hwt. wrestler for Nationals this season. He lost a one point decision to a 2X NCAA champion. So maybe Schwab just might have his guy at that weight for a few years. A soph, no less. Just another good young wrestler at UNI.

You want to debate me? I love it. But have a little more ammo in your arsenal if you want to try again.

And about that comment that you "know the problems" at Iowa State... care to share or is that another one of your BIG secrets? What a joke!


My edit is in regards to the top five finishes.. He did finish top five in Omaha, but we know whose guys he was coaching.

This post was edited on 5/8 10:37 PM by MitchL

 

[oonfoofoo]

The great thing about sports related message boards is that people that have never competed or were not good at any sport can come on the boards and criticize those that do under the guise of a google search on how or what somebody is doing.


Meeks was a great wrestler in high school and nothing you can say or do can deny that. He is good in college and nothing you can say or do can deny that. Can he make AA? That's up to him and how bad he wants it. Will he transfer? Will he lose his scholarship? Who knows. MitchL you have no clue.

If Mr. Meeks made this apology on the U of I boards then let me ask why this post was not posted on that board? I think if you have the problem with the Meeks family you should create a new thread on that board and title it "Keith Meeks can I ask you a question" and make sure you add in the part about financial hardship.

Good luck

 

[MitchL]

Gosh... you're made three or four posts on this thread, and EVERY one of them had been the exact same thing.

Mr. Meeks created this whole controversy a few years back when his son was being recruited. I've followed college recruiting of high school athletes for a good many years. I have never heard or read of a parent saying anything negative about any school that was actively attempting to get an athlete to commit to a school.

Most parents will say various complimentary things about all involved schools. They may favor some schools over others, but you just don't say anything nasty about certain colleges/programs. Mr. Meeks chose to say several rude, disparaging remarks about the coaches(past and present) in Iowa City. He even went as far as to say that he didn't think Tom Brands was giving his son the respect he thought he deserved.

That type of arrogance will make enemies every day of the week. And it served absolutely no purpose. If the family had already determined John would not attend Iowa, why not keep that decision to yourself? That kind of stupidity deserves scrutiny. Keith Meeks is a very proud man, obviously. Common sense seems to be lacking, tho.

 

[oonfoofoo]

Again, great place to hide in anonymity and bad mouth somebody.

 

[MitchL]

Facts are facts. Sorry, you can't accept reality.

 

[oonfoofoo]

Yes you are correct. Facts are facts....I think that is the same as facts = facts or parts is parts...but yes that means the same thing.

I can accept reality and just as it is your accusation the Mr. Meeks is somewhat of a lowly person to you it is also true that you calling somebody out in the fashion that you have is just as lowly. As I said I know the family and the man and you must also because that is how you get away with calling him out.

John, if you are reading this(ha) good luck to you this next season and I know you will come out just fine....contrary to what Mitch would like to see.

 

[MitchL]

Debating you is like "shooting fish in a barrel". It's as if you "bring a jack knife to a gunfight".

You are not anywhere close to being objective when analyzing my points. I don't know that family and that is why I am able to look at this whole thing without any prejudice. You cannot do that as your judgment is very clouded.

As parents should not message boards, neither should the athletes. That, to your last sentence.

 

[Eleven30]

The fact that this thread is titled "Ha, Ha, Meeks" is pretty telling...the OP is rather childish and immature (at best).

It is simply pathetic to call someone out by name on an anonymous message board with the type of stupidity that's been exhibited in this thread. This is one of the most shameful personal agendas I've seen on IowaPreps.

 

[MitchL]

Tough crap! An over zealous, outspoken parent opens himself up to this sort of scrutiny and criticism when he makes openly negative remarks, as he certainly did, during the recruiting process.

I suspect RRF would be more vocal, even today, if the "on the mat" results were a bit better.

Once again... the timing is curious in regards to his apology.

Any criticism of my motives has nothing to do with the original subject matter.

 

[cidhawkeye]

I am sure you were calling out Mr. Meeks and labeling him as childish and immature when he was calling people out by names.

 

[MitchL]

If you want to go back in the archives from his son's senior season and the whole recruiting process, you will find that RRF and myself had some very spirited debates about his comments regarding both ISU and Iowa.

I think he enjoyed the banter, because he always seemed like a person who relished the limelight. I, and others, many others, thought a redshirt season was the better route. He argued like hell that it was not in the plan to have him redshirt, for the most part. My other argument for a redshirt was that it allowed John another year for academics while still being under a scholly.

But KJ's team was floundering. I guess a unprepared TRUE freshman was perhaps the best option for ISU. But as all now know, he had no business wrestling that first season.

And those of us who thought a redshirt was the way to go... have now been proven correct, pending this years' results.

Not a terribly complicated concept to understand, for most, I guess.

ISU fans have been a group in disarray for several years now. Some may view this thread as rubbing more "salt in the wound". Maybe it is. Big deal.

I have really never attacked anyone personally, but I have been critical of an outspoken few people who try to play the "victim" when things go south.

 

[oonfoofoo]

This was an Iowa State wrestling program and Meeks family decision. So you are saying a 50% or so record wasn't good enough for a true freshman with the guys he wrestled his freshman year? What? Redshirt and he goes undefeated his RS Freshman year? Not a bad year for a true freshman if you ask me. Also from my understanding he was pretty good in the classroom also.

So what? You thought it was better if John redshirted? What? They didn't call you to ask for your opinion on this?

I am sure that you are much more knowledgeable about wrestling than Jackson or anyone that was involved in that decision.

When the Iowa State staff contacted you about the decision for John to redshirt this past year I am curious what advice you gave them. I have an up and coming 6 year old that is 109 - 0 right now and I want to make sure we make the right college decision for him, maybe you can help.

You're an idiot! That's all I really wanted to say

 

[MitchL]

This is my last post on this thread.

We'll see how next season goes and we'll see how accurate my views and predictions are.

BTW: Ever consider a personal trainer/coach for your son/daughter? Also, you're not getting a full ride offer from the Hawks, imo. Few athletes justify that in D-1.

 

[oonfoofoo]

What, your predication that he won't be an all - american? I can probably predict that I won't be CEO of my company by the end of next year and I would probably be right.

And my kid is 109 -0? At 6 years how does that not qualify him for D1 scholarship status?

Sounds like you have a lot of influence so maybe I could get your to be his agent and then he will be a D1 guy?

You'll be back... you can't help it.