3A First Round State Talk: #2 Pella vs. #7 Perry
- Thread starter LukeFeddersen
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Perry is on a roll right now, but this seems like a rough draw for them because of Pella's style of play. Would have really helped if these two teams played earlier this year, but they didn't. IMO this is gonna be the biggest win in a relatively even field (compared to the last few years for sure). Pella by 15.
Title chances for Pella are probably highest of any of the public schools. I think no matter what, they'll have a dog fight in the semifinals and finals if they make it.
I am biased but I think Perry actually has a shot this game. They have been one of the most high powered offenses in 3A all season and can score on anyone. The difference is they have finally started playing defense as well. These last 5 games they have been giving up 55 points a game, 12 ppg under what they had been doing. If they can keep playing with that defensive intensity they definitely have a shot. I don't know if I would go so far as to predict the upset, but I think it will be closer than a lot of people expect. It should be a highly entertaining fast paced basketball game that is for sure.
This game will not end well for Perry. The issue will be the Pella D. Perry hasn't faced anything that comes close to the kind of pressure Pella will hit them with in the Well.
Congrats to Perry!! Not many (including myself) gave them a chance and they made it.
Congrats to Perry!! Not many (including myself) gave them a chance and they made it.
Congrats to both teams for making it. This should be a very uptempo, entertaining game to watch. Pella will certainly not slow it down and I doubt Perry will either. I agree with Stickman, the D will decide this game. Pella will run 10 athletic guys at you and try to overwhelm you and/or wear you down until you start making mistakes. Perry has plenty of good players and will get plenty of points, but I'm not sure they really want to get into a track meet with Pella. Not sure that is a style that will work in this instance. The teams that have success against Pella have really slowed it down or just went insane with 3 point shooting (WDM Valley). Teams that have tried to run with them generally get blown out. Looking forward to a very entertaining game.
Perry can't run with Pella... They'll be gassed by half time. The teams Perry played during the regular season struggled guarding Shammond. Pella will have no problem guarding Shammond
If the refs call it fairly close, then Perry is in the game. If they let it go, then Pella's defense will run away with it.
Either way, I think Shammond will have a big game and shoot a ton of free throws with Pella rotating several guys on him.
Either way, I think Shammond will have a big game and shoot a ton of free throws with Pella rotating several guys on him.
If the refs call it close, I think Shammond will have his own problems. Also, Pella played Valley and neither Turner, Marble, or Curry had their way with them, so I am not sure the Ivory's pose that level of threat.
Ivory has worked hard and has decent basketball skill but isn't the fastest player and often in big games or in tough matchups finds himself in foul trouble. I really could see that being an issue as he faces the fastest, most athletic team he has faced this season.
Good luck to both teams. There will be a lot in interest in this game.
I will give you that he has a propensity to pick up some dumb fouls and that could be an issue in this game. Perry can't afford to have him on the bench for long stretches. But come on man, decent skill and not fast? Shammond has averaged 21 a game over the last three years. He is one of the more skilled basketball players I have seen. He has excellent handles and is great at finishing around the rim. He is also incredibly quick and has made a living getting by defenders and to the hole. I highly doubt many people would share your assessment.
Sorry Sarcastico but we are going to have to disagree on this one. Perhaps you look at a different circle of players than myself because there is no way I could consider him "one of the more skilled basketball players I have seen. "
As I've said Ivory does possess some basketball skills especially on offense/scoring and he obviously has a love for the game and worked hard at it but if all you are going to judge him on is 21 points per game for 3 years here is where it gets sketchy. He is not an overall polished player and not a top tier athlete. Human nature usually nudges people into working on what they "like" to do and not necessarily what they "need" to do to develop. That is what I see when watching Ivory play. He has spent a lot of time developing skills to assist his scoring but he is not a strong player elsewhere and if he did possess the speed you feel he has his other stats would reflect it and they just don't
What does 21 ppg mean? That depends on several things. If you play a schedule like Wahlert that would mean a lot more than if you play a schedule like Perry's that has never been in the top 1/2 of 3A teams during Ivory's tenure and averages in the bottom 1/3. Likewise..with points allowed (defense). If you played a schedule such as Perry's you would expect them to have better defense than 54, 56, 57, and 61 of the 64 3a schools (bottom 10% average). I not only think that Ivory's weakness in other skills besides offense contribute to the defensive rating I also believe the poor defense actually HELPS Ivory offensively. If an opponent is having no issues getting the points they need to beat Perry why would they risk foul problems playing hard defense against Ivory especially when for 3 of Ivory's 4 years other teams also had to defend against the highly athletic Whiton? As long as I'm scoring more than Perry I'm not going to be overly concerned about shutting their key players down.
Not trying to detract from Ivory as a high school player because he has done well and has been a valuable piece of Perry's team but IMO Pella's D will have no issues with containing Ivory enough to get a convincing win.
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Saw Ivory play this last summer. Kid has game and loves to compete. He was definitely one of the top 10 kids in the summer grassroots season. Never seen Pella play, sounds like there a deep team. Shammond probably best player on the floor in this game, doesn't mean they'll win though.
Not all "players" are in the summer ball, so your sampling could be off. Top10 of what group. Hockenson (Chariton) doesn't play summer ball and could easily be considered a top 10 player. Pella has several top shelf athletes that don't play summer ball due to Football, etc. Great athletes don't always translate into great basketball players, but in Pella's case it certainly is close. I would say that Pella has at least 4 guys that can play at Ivory's level, and the next 5 are not far from it. Ivory is in for a rough night..
Hockenson does play AAU ball. He played on the same team as Ivory, Kingdom Hoops. Hokenson is good, but I think Ivory is better. Never seen Pella play, but if they have several guys similar to Ivory then Perry is in trouble.
You sure you are not confusing Hockenson (6'7 Tight End Iowa recruit) with Laing (6'1 shooting guard) also from Chariton. Laing is a deadly 3 point guy.
You know, I wouldn't say Pella has many guys who are just outstanding individual BBall players. Vanwyk is really good, but mostly they are just a bunch of athletic guys that fly around the court and work as a team and just know how to win. Many of them have other sports that they focus on more, but just like to play BBall as well. 3 of them have D1 scholarships in other sports.
I doubt if Hockenson played AAU ball as he has been football camping the last two summers, although I could be wrong. If he did then that is one crazy busy young man.
I still say he is a really skilled player and an amazing offensive talent. This game really only confirmed that for me. He consistently was able to beat his defender of the dribble and weave through Pella's defense to either get a score or get fouled. I honestly think he could have scored a lot more if he was more aggressive on offense. Pella was having a hard time stopping his penetration in the first half. Then they went to that zone which really took Perry's whole team out of their game.
Pella scored the bulk of their points against Perry's zone or in transition. Hard to single out just one player for that. I can't remember him getting beat in the short span they ran man to man defense. He had a few turnovers against, but so would many PG's the way Pella came out and played tonight. He also was able to consistently beat their press and advance the ball. I have watched every game in the tournament so far and I still say Shammond is one of the better guards you are going to see at the high school level. He would have lit up a lot of teams down there. Keep on hating though. Crapping on high school kids isn't pathetic at all.
Pella scored the bulk of their points against Perry's zone or in transition. Hard to single out just one player for that. I can't remember him getting beat in the short span they ran man to man defense. He had a few turnovers against, but so would many PG's the way Pella came out and played tonight. He also was able to consistently beat their press and advance the ball. I have watched every game in the tournament so far and I still say Shammond is one of the better guards you are going to see at the high school level. He would have lit up a lot of teams down there. Keep on hating though. Crapping on high school kids isn't pathetic at all.
i'm not hating on shammond I'm giving you an honest opinion about his talent…IMO he's a weak defender and will not be able to handle the ball at the college level unless he gets in the gym… I like the kid and I'll tell him straight up what he needs to work on…Hopefully he will watch this tape and get back in the gym and work on his game before he attempts to go play at a Juco college....he can be a D1 player but he's got to get in the gym,again I like Shammond and he is a talent
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Shammond does not have a lot of support around him, but he will have to get used to this tempo of game. The pace that Pella sets is not all that different from any Juco game I've watched. Also I think there are times that Pella would almost let him drive the 40ft just to run him and keep the tempo up. He never really came out, and I don't think there is anyone in the state that can run that pace for the full game. Most of the team was gassed after the first 5 mins. Pella can not only run, but they have the girth to beat you around a bit. Perry should be very pleased they made it to the Well. Its a great experience and a great way for Shammond to cap his HS career. Hats off to both teams.
I'm not hating Shammond either. If my opinion is wrong and Sarcastico is right then Shammond will make the All Tournament First Team.
I wouldn't hold my breath on an All Tournament Team selection..even though Shammond does lead the tournament (all classes) in one stat. Turnovers.
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Was at the game last night. Is everybody on Pella 6'2"? Every player looked exactly the same to me, a 6 foot 2 white kid. And boy are they quick. Didn't know anything about them, but they were fun to watch. Did bad on FTs last night, could have cracked 100 if they upped their game there. I'm interested in seeing a team like Xavier against them. How a bunch of tall kids would do. After one quarter, I thought Xavier would win. But watching a whole game of Pella, I think Pella will probably win by 10 or so.
If you look at Pella's roster on QuikstatsIowa, about half of their team is between 6'2" and 6'5".
Another difference is that they are 6'2-6'5 but a majority are very athletic around that 190-200lb range, so pretty solid, they did bring their heftier player (6'3 230)early last night to work on Perry's post down low, who was already gassed from the track meet. Xavier's "bigs" look to be 6'7 and 150lbs
If this is you not hating I wouldn't want to see what it looks like when you do. Shammond won't make the all-tournament team,which there is only one of by the way. Nobody who loses first round does unless they have just a ridiculous game like Jansen did. I don't think that makes you right or me wrong. We obviously just aren't going to agree on this one. It is pointless arguing about it.
...and if you consider this hating then sir you must also considering it hating to the elite top players by insisting someone with skill not as developed as their's being considered their peer.
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